I never seem to see the L2501 listed. Same as the other Ls?
Makes me just want to wire it to a fake light switch. Lol.
Makes me just want to wire it to a fake light switch. Lol.
I'm an idiot and lost my keys. Now what?
- Thread starter Evad
- Start date
Russell King
Well-known member
Equipment
L185F, Modern Ag Competitor 4’ shredder, Rhino tiller, rear dirt scoop
It can also be the country the lock originates from has different blanks that are slightly different.
I have a gate opener that is manufactured in Mexico and I have tried to get a spare key made for but the spare key almost got jammed in the lock due to the thickness of the key. Locksmith had mentioned that the original key and blank key were slightly different since the key was probably from a foreign country.
fried1765
Well-known member
Equipment
Kubota L48 TLB, Ford 1920 FEL, Ford 8N, SCAG Liberty Z, Gravely Pro.
Is it not possible to "mic" an OEM blank thickness, and grind an aftermarket blank to the OEM thickness?
Elliott in GA
Well-known member
Equipment
LX 2610SU w/535,LP RCR1860,FDR1660,SGC0554,FSP500, DD BBX60005
Well, there you have it. You cannot cut an Airstream rv key without a quality blank, and there are some low quality blanks out there.
I do not see how this differs from what I posted.
You said you had to buy a key from Airstream, which is not the case.
Since Airstream does not make the lock or key, you can buy the correct blank from Airstream and other sources.
Airstreamers posting about how Airstreams are unique is nothing rare.
And in any case, your unfortunate experience with your Airstream keys does not invalidate what I posted about RV keys in general and Kubota keys.
I’ll try to remain courteous about this. It appears to me that you merely wish to be perceived as “smart” about the subject of Airstream replacement keys when, in fact, you don’t know as much as you think you do. That’s OK, tho’. You don’t own one so I don’t expect you’ll be faced with the issue.
I'm an idiot and lost my keys.
Just think about this for a moment, and then read all the replies. I believe that you are the smart one to ask the question, and most of the others who want to debate Airstream keys are idiots. The only thing that I can see wrong with your original post is that you lost the key, not the keys unless you are referring to the second key that came with your tractor also lost, but even that doesn't elevate you to being an idiot, just a person that misplaced a key or keys.
Just think about this for a moment, and then read all the replies. I believe that you are the smart one to ask the question, and most of the others who want to debate Airstream keys are idiots. The only thing that I can see wrong with your original post is that you lost the key, not the keys unless you are referring to the second key that came with your tractor also lost, but even that doesn't elevate you to being an idiot, just a person that misplaced a key or keys.
whitetiger
Moderator
Staff member
Equipment
Kubota tech..BX2370, RCK60, B7100HST, RTV900 w plow, Ford 1100 FWA
Dusty, the Idiocy is in the inability to follow the thread. Not the OP…but a subsequent person suggested that tractor keys are like RV keys and can be almost common/replacements. This was not correct and Airstreams were used as an example of how that is not universally correct. If that confuses you…then the only idiotic behavior is that of insulting other participants who wished to discuss the finer issues of replacement keys. It damages relationships and cheapens the forums.
There is always someone who will argue until someone else cries "uncle". Sometime just declare "so what" in your mind and move on!!! 
I did follow the tread, through all its twists and turns, along with your claim of superior ability to make a key.
Evidently you were not capable of following twists and turns…or you’d not have incorrectly thought I made any such claim.
Just following up - I ordered a pack of 5 keys from Amazon for $7 and they fit and work perfectly. Thanks again for all the help and believe me I will keep spare keys in different places and have purchased LARGE orange keychains to keep me from losing them in the future
I’m not a locksmith either, but over the years I help out my older locksmith buddy every now and then. I’m also his “go to” person for help on older combination dial safe lockouts. Those jobs are fun and I’ve rebuilt some nice older dial locks for some of his customers.
When he has trouble with his key cutters, he asks me to help figure out the issues.
On one of his key cutters (an older style key copier) he had just replaced the cutting wheel on. It would cut some keys OK and they’d work fine. Other keys after cutting would look identical to the original but would not work.
Only after setting up and using dial caliper and taking some micrometer readings on both the keys and the cutter itself was I able to figure out what was happening. Even though his new cutting wheel was an exact replacement (supposedly) it turned out to be a few thousands of an inch thicker at the mandrel than the original. Who'd have guessed?? Depending on the type of keys being duplicated, that small difference was enough to cause some keys not to work. Only after downloading the specs for the keys, did we find that the distance from the key’s shoulder to the first cut was off enough to cause problems with some keys. After correcting for the new cutting wheel’s difference did every key copied now work. That machine was only capable of duplicating non-chipped keys or just making/copying the cuts on other edge cut keys.
A real challenge came in trying to figure out his programmable key cutting machine that would cut auto keys for the chipped style of keys. The model was an older BD Laser that could copy a key, cut a key from a code set in the programmer, could read a code from a key and store everything in its memory, etc. It had different vises for different style keys for the different auto makes. It could cut single edge cuts, double cuts, center cuts and everything but the newer dimple cut keys.
The trouble was certain types of keys after cutting would not work. Some might work with certain codes but not others. Nothing seemed consistent between the different types. The machine was older and not supported anymore (or so it seemed). It occasionally gets transported to different locations so was susceptible to bumps & vibrations.
After hours and hours of head scratching over an extended period of time, I think we’ve solved its mysteries. Again, it required use of my granite gauge block and dial calipers to help figure out the multiple issues that had occurred over time.
One issue was the different vises for the different style keys were added to his “set” at different times. They have calibration “points” for setting the cutter height when used. When clamped in the machine, each calibration point was a few “thou” higher/lower than the others which necessitated resetting the cutter height each and every time a different vise was used.
Another issue was found in the program itself. For each vise there were correction factors that could be entered for each axis of cut (x and y axis). When new or different vises had been changed or added those correction factors had not been calibrated to the new/different vise. The correction factors would line up the centerline of the key to be cut with the centerline of the cutter bit or tracer bit. If those correction factors were not correct, then turning the key over for cutting the other side would double the error. Again, getting the factory specs for the proper cuts and spacing for keys to each vise helped to enter proper correction factors for that particular vise.
Another issue was the clamp on one vise had been bent so slightly that it could not be seen by eye. But using the gauge block and dial calipers it revealed that the clamped key was not held in place perfectly flat in the vise. When the cutter traveled in the y-axis the depth of cut got progressively shallower. You couldn’t eyeball the difference. But it was enough to prevent some keys from being inserted all the way and not working or binding up some of the lock’s innards. Before finding the issue, they had tried changing the cutter height by by using shims to lower or raise the cutter bit to try to compensate for the difference. That led to other ill effects on the keys causing other issues. After fixing that vise's clamp, the keys traveled perfectly flat on the machine and could be now be copied or cut by code with no issues.
Another issue was found to be in the key blanks themselves. On the high security keys, the blanks had to be exact to that blank’s specs. I noticed on some of his blanks that they had been stamped out (cheap blanks). The stamping had left the edges at an angle rather than square. From an end view, they looked like a parallelogram rather than a perfect rectangle. But that difference was enough to cause the cuts to fall out of specs by a few thou and the key might or might not work. The good key blanks had perfectly square edges.
One vise would not sit perfectly square to the machine when clamped in place. Found with the dial caliper we corrected an issue in one of its v-ways. The dial caliper next proved the clamped key traveled exactly parallel with the cutter bit.
Solving all these issues took some head scratching and burning through a number of key blanks. But from the experience I learned: (Just to name a few) From his key blank books….there are literally thousands of different key blanks available. Some can vary by just a few thousandths of an inch in thickness, width, location of grooves, length of the key to its shoulder, thickness of the center web, etc., etc. Certain cuts can’t be next to a certain cut. The depths and lengths of the cuts have to fall within the factory specs to work consistently in a good lock/ignition. If the lock’s or ignition's pins, wafers, or what ever have worn enough…then even a proper code cut key needs to be adjusted for that wear in the lock itself. It only takes a few “thou” difference in depth of cut, thickness or width of the key blank (improper blank) or the key might not work. The same applies to internal wear on the lock or ignition. Center web thickness has to be very very close, etc., etc.
It's not hard to imagine where one might have one issue with a certain key or lock that can be different from another’s experience with the same key or lock. And choosing the correct key blank can be daunting given all the minute variations amongst blanks from different suppliers that visually look identical. One situation most likely doesn’t set the stage for solving the next person's situation. Every lock, ignition, key or cut can be a mystery to solve.
Recently, I asked the locksmith buddy how his fancy key cutting machine has been working lately. His reply, “It’s like a horse nibbling oats out of your hand! The locks almost feel like they want to suck the key into it’s slot and everything works!!”
When he has trouble with his key cutters, he asks me to help figure out the issues.
On one of his key cutters (an older style key copier) he had just replaced the cutting wheel on. It would cut some keys OK and they’d work fine. Other keys after cutting would look identical to the original but would not work.
Only after setting up and using dial caliper and taking some micrometer readings on both the keys and the cutter itself was I able to figure out what was happening. Even though his new cutting wheel was an exact replacement (supposedly) it turned out to be a few thousands of an inch thicker at the mandrel than the original. Who'd have guessed?? Depending on the type of keys being duplicated, that small difference was enough to cause some keys not to work. Only after downloading the specs for the keys, did we find that the distance from the key’s shoulder to the first cut was off enough to cause problems with some keys. After correcting for the new cutting wheel’s difference did every key copied now work. That machine was only capable of duplicating non-chipped keys or just making/copying the cuts on other edge cut keys.
A real challenge came in trying to figure out his programmable key cutting machine that would cut auto keys for the chipped style of keys. The model was an older BD Laser that could copy a key, cut a key from a code set in the programmer, could read a code from a key and store everything in its memory, etc. It had different vises for different style keys for the different auto makes. It could cut single edge cuts, double cuts, center cuts and everything but the newer dimple cut keys.
The trouble was certain types of keys after cutting would not work. Some might work with certain codes but not others. Nothing seemed consistent between the different types. The machine was older and not supported anymore (or so it seemed). It occasionally gets transported to different locations so was susceptible to bumps & vibrations.
After hours and hours of head scratching over an extended period of time, I think we’ve solved its mysteries. Again, it required use of my granite gauge block and dial calipers to help figure out the multiple issues that had occurred over time.
One issue was the different vises for the different style keys were added to his “set” at different times. They have calibration “points” for setting the cutter height when used. When clamped in the machine, each calibration point was a few “thou” higher/lower than the others which necessitated resetting the cutter height each and every time a different vise was used.
Another issue was found in the program itself. For each vise there were correction factors that could be entered for each axis of cut (x and y axis). When new or different vises had been changed or added those correction factors had not been calibrated to the new/different vise. The correction factors would line up the centerline of the key to be cut with the centerline of the cutter bit or tracer bit. If those correction factors were not correct, then turning the key over for cutting the other side would double the error. Again, getting the factory specs for the proper cuts and spacing for keys to each vise helped to enter proper correction factors for that particular vise.
Another issue was the clamp on one vise had been bent so slightly that it could not be seen by eye. But using the gauge block and dial calipers it revealed that the clamped key was not held in place perfectly flat in the vise. When the cutter traveled in the y-axis the depth of cut got progressively shallower. You couldn’t eyeball the difference. But it was enough to prevent some keys from being inserted all the way and not working or binding up some of the lock’s innards. Before finding the issue, they had tried changing the cutter height by by using shims to lower or raise the cutter bit to try to compensate for the difference. That led to other ill effects on the keys causing other issues. After fixing that vise's clamp, the keys traveled perfectly flat on the machine and could be now be copied or cut by code with no issues.
Another issue was found to be in the key blanks themselves. On the high security keys, the blanks had to be exact to that blank’s specs. I noticed on some of his blanks that they had been stamped out (cheap blanks). The stamping had left the edges at an angle rather than square. From an end view, they looked like a parallelogram rather than a perfect rectangle. But that difference was enough to cause the cuts to fall out of specs by a few thou and the key might or might not work. The good key blanks had perfectly square edges.
One vise would not sit perfectly square to the machine when clamped in place. Found with the dial caliper we corrected an issue in one of its v-ways. The dial caliper next proved the clamped key traveled exactly parallel with the cutter bit.
Solving all these issues took some head scratching and burning through a number of key blanks. But from the experience I learned: (Just to name a few) From his key blank books….there are literally thousands of different key blanks available. Some can vary by just a few thousandths of an inch in thickness, width, location of grooves, length of the key to its shoulder, thickness of the center web, etc., etc. Certain cuts can’t be next to a certain cut. The depths and lengths of the cuts have to fall within the factory specs to work consistently in a good lock/ignition. If the lock’s or ignition's pins, wafers, or what ever have worn enough…then even a proper code cut key needs to be adjusted for that wear in the lock itself. It only takes a few “thou” difference in depth of cut, thickness or width of the key blank (improper blank) or the key might not work. The same applies to internal wear on the lock or ignition. Center web thickness has to be very very close, etc., etc.
It's not hard to imagine where one might have one issue with a certain key or lock that can be different from another’s experience with the same key or lock. And choosing the correct key blank can be daunting given all the minute variations amongst blanks from different suppliers that visually look identical. One situation most likely doesn’t set the stage for solving the next person's situation. Every lock, ignition, key or cut can be a mystery to solve.
Recently, I asked the locksmith buddy how his fancy key cutting machine has been working lately. His reply, “It’s like a horse nibbling oats out of your hand! The locks almost feel like they want to suck the key into it’s slot and everything works!!”
HAHA! I'll ask him.....but as long as he's been a locksmith....I'd bet an Airstream has crossed his path a time or two. He's 85 and has been locksmithing since a young man while starting out with the local legend at the time.
I'll report back after I see him again.
Lose your kubota key? Go to dealer, order another one. Simple. I have one of every key that every kubota used (with one exception that I can think of), when I worked at the dealer. Had to buy them myself. Most of them came in sets of two, so I stashed the "spares" and gave them to folks that lost their key. Ran out of "spares" pretty quickly but still have my key chain full of kubota keys. Or mostly full. Sometimes the sales guys would "borrow" one, and of course being salespeople, wouldn't return em.
yes I think they've resorted to giving one key with the equipment now. Used to be two. Saving money I guess.
Most of the L series use the same key.
Most of the M series use the same key.
L and M series cab, different than L and M without cab.
B series, 2 different ones that I can think of.
BX and RTV series are mostly the same (RTV cab is different)
I think a lot of the little excavators use the same key, and also the skid steers. I may be wrong on those, I didn't deal with many of them (thankfully). Only had one key and it fit every one of them we had at the time, though.
Deere is similar, one key will fit a whole bunch of tractors. Cat similar.
I don't know about airstream nor do I really care since this is not an Airstream forum.. Ask an airsteam dealer.
yes I think they've resorted to giving one key with the equipment now. Used to be two. Saving money I guess.
Most of the L series use the same key.
Most of the M series use the same key.
L and M series cab, different than L and M without cab.
B series, 2 different ones that I can think of.
BX and RTV series are mostly the same (RTV cab is different)
I think a lot of the little excavators use the same key, and also the skid steers. I may be wrong on those, I didn't deal with many of them (thankfully). Only had one key and it fit every one of them we had at the time, though.
Deere is similar, one key will fit a whole bunch of tractors. Cat similar.
I don't know about airstream nor do I really care since this is not an Airstream forum.. Ask an airsteam dealer.
Bmyers
Well-known member
Lifetime Member
Equipment
Grand L3560 with LA805 loader, EA 55" Wicked Grapple, SBX72 BB, LP 1272 mower
