Should i buy an L2501?

[fatboycowen]

I'm getting close to pulling the trigger on an L2501 with FEL and Backhoe, but i'm having some second thoughts, and want some advice.

I've wanted a tractor for years. I have 4 acres, mostly wooded. I would use it for clearing land, firewood work, moving loam and gravel, snow removal, moving rocks, etc.

A close friend has a B3030 with loader and backhoe, and has brought it over to help with some things, and it's so useful. I've decided now is the time to get one.

The L2501 is on sale right now, and is actually cheaper than the B2650 with similar implements. It seems crazy to go with the B over the L, given the price. I need to see them side by side, but, i really want the heavier duty tractor.

The one thing i'm troubled about is weight. I like the idea of the heavier tractor, but moving it will be difficult. I have a car trailer, but the total weight with implements is just over the GVWR of the trailer. Maybe it's not a big deal as long as i don't go far. But part of me wants to be able to bring the tractor to friend's houses to help with things.

So, how much better will the bigger tractor be? Is the L2501 really the better buy, given the big sale?

 

[DamCraig]

I currently have an L2501 with FEL and have previously used an older BX22. When I went shopping for a new Kubota I went there looking for a B series and quickly realized that for what I needed to do - 10 acres, road maint, snow removal, etc - that the extra weight of the L was going to be needed. No regrets at this point.

 

[North Idaho Wolfman]

Simple, trade in your trailer for a larger one!

You can never have too much tractor or tools!

 

[fatboycowen]

So, i just returned from the dealer. Test drove it. Didn't see a BH77, but i've used an older BH75, so no big deal.

Tractor is nice. Pretty basic, but i like it.

Priced out
L2501 HST with loader, 66" quick disconnect bucket, grille guard and loaded R4 tires plus BH77 w/16" bucket and thumb - $26800.
I'd be financing, so i'd add insurance. They priced it as a total of $1784. Seemed higher than i thought it would be. That's $356 per year, if it's over the 5 year loan term. Not sure how that works. Then tax and stuff, and they would include delivery for free.

How does that price sound?

 

[Eray]

Kubota priced me insurance on my new L2501HST at $275 per year. I bought it from Farm Bureau for $141 per year.

 

[DamCraig]

As I understand it, when you do the insurance through Kubota it is just rolled into the total cost. I checked it against my insurance and the Kubota was cheaper so I went with it. Those I have talked to that have had claims loved it as it covers just about anything, including stupidity apparently.

 

[coreyperez]

Morning!

My first post and just recently started looking though this site (last night, 16 July 15). I'm in the market, VERY NEAR market to purchase a small tractor. I was convinced I was going with the L3301, as I was convinced when in Alabama last month, to stay away from the L2501. I've since talked with a local dealer (Fairbanks AK) and cannot remember for the life of me why I was convinced NOT to go with the 2501. I'm willing to admit, I'm the "bigger is better" type of guy, I can afford the 3301, but my (as well as many others) concerns are the DPF.

This is pushing me heavily towards the 2501. This is combined with doing research last night that has shown that the L3301 has had DPF issues in cold weather. I cannot find the link, but a guy posted that they had a small Kubota that would not regen in cold weather because the motor would not get "hot enough" to start the process properly. He posted -15deg (ish) temps if I remember correctly. We typically get to -35 and remain for the winter, but will dip to -60.

So, back to the L2501. As I stated, I cannot find that previous post i'm referencing, but there was also discussion about the L2501 didn't have a particular type of pump, or capability. They discussed post hole diggers and the ability to reverse the auger out, etc. What specifics should I be concerned about with the land pride "grapple". I know there are two sizes, the dealer believed both the large and small would fit, and would require the additional "3rd point hydraulic" to be added/plumbed into the existing system. Would the 2501 be able to (hydraulically) handle that much?

I'm new to the terminology, so I'm sorry about not knowing what I'm trying to exactly "reference". I also seem to remember a "Kubota specific" term, topNtilt or something....

Also. Probably the most silly question. What is FEL?

My usages: 4 acres, x2 wooded, x2 clear with little "service" required on the cleared property, ie: no mowing) I'm hoping to get about 10 acres (wooded) and will have this tractor doing extensive work there when that time comes. Typical duties will be land clearing, snow removal, and just driving it around being a "dude, doing dude things".

The dealer is holding a 2501 for me (until today).

Corey

 

[ShaunRH]

FEL is Front End Loader (the loader you are referencing)

I have 6 acres and an L3200. It works well for me but it's mostly flat. I have only found a need for a bit more horsepower if I'm unwilling to drive slower while mowing. Then I settle for driving slower and wishing I had a couple more horses. Other than that, 32hp has been fine for me. You are looking at 25hp and it will probably be fine but you might find yourself in a situation where you want more horses but just have to slow down to do something in that situation to use the horses you have. That's pretty normal.

I, speaking only for myself, am unwilling to pay tons more money for the rare instance I need the greater horses. So, I think your L2501 should work for 4 acres, but realize that it's a compact tractor and won't be able to run with something like an M series unit!

 

[KennedyFarmer]

I'm getting close to pulling the trigger on an L2501 with FEL and Backhoe, but i'm having some second thoughts, and want some advice.

I've wanted a tractor for years. I have 4 acres, mostly wooded. I would use it for clearing land, firewood work, moving loam and gravel, snow removal, moving rocks, etc.

A close friend has a B3030 with loader and backhoe, and has brought it over to help with some things, and it's so useful. I've decided now is the time to get one.

The L2501 is on sale right now, and is actually cheaper than the B2650 with similar implements. It seems crazy to go with the B over the L, given the price. I need to see them side by side, but, i really want the heavier duty tractor.

The one thing i'm troubled about is weight. I like the idea of the heavier tractor, but moving it will be difficult. I have a car trailer, but the total weight with implements is just over the GVWR of the trailer. Maybe it's not a big deal as long as i don't go far. But part of me wants to be able to bring the tractor to friend's houses to help with things.

So, how much better will the bigger tractor be? Is the L2501 really the better buy, given the big sale?

Sounds to me your trailer might be the issue here, which no one has mentioned. As you read on the forum's never over load a trailer things can go bad fast. Really fast!

 

[coreyperez]

Shaun,

Thanks for the specifics. I'm still leaning towards the 2501. I went and talked a few more specifics regarding the different tractors, even looking at the 3901. The DPF is the only thing holding me back. I've been assured that there shouldn't be an issue with the DPF, even in the cold weather. They have had these tractors up here a year or so and haven't had issues with them. When I mentioned the cold weather DPF issue, he smiled, turned and pointed at the smaller B series, and said "yup, this one right here has had problems, but they have worked them out".

So, I initially had planned on getting the 3301, they shipped the 3301 up from Anchorage (8+ hrs south of us) and were assembling it when I came in). He said come back Monday, they will put them side by side, and let me lose in their "testing area". I'm actually planning on bringing the wife in and despite her not being interested in this purchase, I'm going to see if she can make any suggestion.

I really want the 3301, but that "voice" is saying 2501. I've just never been a fan of the NEWEST devices. The other issue is the ability to run the grapple I'm wanting to run on the front. Weight wise, they can lift the same, so that rules out that issue (is also why i looked into the 3901, if I ended up going DPF, why not right?!?!?!)

Well, I'm sitting in front of the computer with the intention of finding a solution. I've been unable to find any real "solution" for the DPF Delete (options), and we (sales/self) talked to the newest school trained Tech about a "scenario" where it would have to be bypassed/removed. He (tech) mentioned how it could be bypassed (short-term) but wouldn't really be able to be removed (due to the computer).

On that thought, I (without knowing really anything about these systems) would assume that there would be a pre-sensor and post-sensor that reads pressure differential (confirmed by the Tech), but also believe that they also read temperature. So, if you could put the probes into a "clean" environment and still read temperature (welded bung into exhaust but not exposed to the gasses) it seems the system would just be happily trucking along.

Onto Google...

Corey

FEL is Front End Loader (the loader you are referencing)

I have 6 acres and an L3200. It works well for me but it's mostly flat. I have only found a need for a bit more horsepower if I'm unwilling to drive slower while mowing. Then I settle for driving slower and wishing I had a couple more horses. Other than that, 32hp has been fine for me. You are looking at 25hp and it will probably be fine but you might find yourself in a situation where you want more horses but just have to slow down to do something in that situation to use the horses you have. That's pretty normal.

I, speaking only for myself, am unwilling to pay tons more money for the rare instance I need the greater horses. So, I think your L2501 should work for 4 acres, but realize that it's a compact tractor and won't be able to run with something like an M series unit!

 

[sheepfarmer]

http://www.orangetractortalks.com/forums/showthread.php?t=18025

Corey, here is another thought. If you are even faintly considering operating a tractor at -60F, you will really need a cab. If you are going to get a tier IV tractor and can swing it, the Grand L tractors have a number of features that make managing the regeneration cycles easier. In addition the bigger engines generate more heat.

There are a bunch of us in Michigan and Canada with tier IV L's that are doing ok. There was a recall on them last winter and the fix seems to have solved the problems you mentioned. There is info about it in the tier IV thread, post 5, link above. That said, I would be hesitant to run my tractor at -60 if I thought it was due to regenerate. Actually I would be hesitant to go outside at -60F The 60 series have a bar graph that shows you how close to a regen you are and you can plan accordingly, the 01s do not, a light just comes on. Besides the dpf filters kubota has put different engines in these tractors, so sometimes it is like comparing apples and oranges. I really like my 3560. The new engines are really easy to start in cold weather, even without a block heater.

So if your thought is to be out plowing snow in a blizzard you might be better off with a bigger tractor.

 

[Eray]

I bought a L2501 for the same reason you suggest. The DPF is a realatively new technology and I am sure in a few years it will be perfected and the smog equipped tractors will be better than the old models just like new cars are more reliable now than the older ones were. I really wanted a L3901 but took a L2501 for the simplicity and peace of mind. So far I do not regret my decision. I'll play with the 2501 for 5 years then trade it for a new tractor after any bugs have been worked out of the technology.

 

[coreyperez]

Sheepfarmer & Eray,

Sheepfarmer,
Thanks for the support (of me semi-hi jacking this thread). I too am from Michigan (Dimondale/Lansing and wife from TC). I just glanced at the Grand versions and UGH.... I could only consider something like that if I was farming with it/making a living. Even if I DO end up making a living with this (harvesting firewood to sell) the environment it would be operating in would destroy all those fancy pieces!

As far as operations in -50/60deg temps. I cannot see a realistic "need" to be operating in those conditions. I used my ATV a few years ago in that cold of an environment and destroyed a few pieces of the plow system (things don't respond well to those temps). I also have since suffered transmission problems since those days, so unless its actually "required" the tractor will be sitting it out. I'd just use the ATV to plow snow and then "clean up" after it warms back up to -35ish.

Eray,
I'm still leaning towards the 2501. I really believe its "too small" for what I'm going to want to do in the long run. I'm just battling with the issues of retiring (military) in the next few years. I'm currently selling my 09 Sierra because of the DPF and going back to the old 5.9l Cummins Diesels (Pre-Emissions).

As Eray had pointed out. The plan to sell that tractor in 5 years and go onto a "now refined" product, my concern is that as I've read from Sheepfarmer's link, there is a 5 year warranty on the emission stuff. It seems "just perfect" that now that its paid off, warranty is gone I'm the one left with dealing with the Tier 4 garbage and the problems.

Both:
This may not be the appropriate place to "ask" this but, is there a listing of every Kubota engine currently produced and what they are being used in? This is a 2 part reason/question. My (simple) thought is, say the 2501 uses engine AAB, 3301 used engine ABC and skid-steer uses engine AAB but an industrial generator uses engine ABC, THEORETICALLY I could take the engine controller, intake/exhaust manifolds, (etc) off a non-emission ABC engine and put it on the tractor... So, the thought was: The ability to swap "hard parts" to eliminate the problem and the "availability" of parts that are servicing a larger "bank" of product = (hopefully) cheaper parts.

Corey

 

[KennedyFarmer]

If low temps are a concern you may need to put in a block heater in the engine so when you do start the tractor the fluids are luke warm vs molasses. Not really sure how the tractor handles re-gen on very cold starts though, maybe call kubota directly and ask versus talking to a dealer that is just guessing or going by experience. when the re-gen cycle occurs the engine is controlled differently by the computer. I just did my first re-gen the other day and it was the coolest day in the week, go figure!

 

[coreyperez]

Up here Kubota installs a "cold climate kit" free of charge, it does include the block heater. I've owned Diesels for the past few years, plus being Military, everything is JP-something-or-another (ie: diesel). I've got the tractor narrowed down to 3 (2501, 3301 and 3901). I wish I could just get a real answer on the DPF Delete for the higher horse power motors. If these were as mainstream as the road vehicles, there would be an off-the-shelf solution already!

Corey

If low temps are a concern you may need to put in a block heater in the engine so when you do start the tractor the fluids are luke warm vs molasses. Not really sure how the tractor handles re-gen on very cold starts though, maybe call kubota directly and ask versus talking to a dealer that is just guessing or going by experience. when the re-gen cycle occurs the engine is controlled differently by the computer. I just did my first re-gen the other day and it was the coolest day in the week, go figure!

 

[KennedyFarmer]

Up here Kubota installs a "cold climate kit" free of charge, it does include the block heater. I've owned Diesels for the past few years, plus being Military, everything is JP-something-or-another (ie: diesel). I've got the tractor narrowed down to 3 (2501, 3301 and 3901). I wish I could just get a real answer on the DPF Delete for the higher horse power motors. If these were as mainstream as the road vehicles, there would be an off-the-shelf solution already!

Corey

there is a good post about tier4 here http://www.orangetractortalks.com/forums/showthread.php?t=18025

Not sure if any has tried to remove or run without the DPF.

 

[KennedyFarmer]

EPA says don't touch the particulate filter, I bet not because its hot!
http://news.pickuptrucks.com/2013/01/epa-says-dont-touch-paticulate-filter.html

 

[nickelplated5s]

Both:
This may not be the appropriate place to "ask" this but, is there a listing of every Kubota engine currently produced and what they are being used in? This is a 2 part reason/question. My (simple) thought is, say the 2501 uses engine AAB, 3301 used engine ABC and skid-steer uses engine AAB but an industrial generator uses engine ABC, THEORETICALLY I could take the engine controller, intake/exhaust manifolds, (etc) off a non-emission ABC engine and put it on the tractor... So, the thought was: The ability to swap "hard parts" to eliminate the problem and the "availability" of parts that are servicing a larger "bank" of product = (hopefully) cheaper parts.

Corey

Good thinking but it won't work. The PCM (computer) won't recognize the different parts. If you put a tuner on (reprogram the PCM) it will remember that fact and your warranty is gone. I even asked a tech why I couldn't buy a new PCM that didn't know I had a tuner previously. Nope, can't get around it that way. With the low numbers, relative to trucks, of tractors sold I doubt anyone will even write the software.

 

[Eray]

I bushhogged about 4 acres of thick grass about as tall as the hood of the tractor yesterday with my L2501HST. It pulled the 5 ft landpride rotary cutter fairly well. With the hydrostatic, anytime the rpms started to drop a little I could just ease up on the pedal and give it a little more time. It cut as fast as I wanted to go in the high grass where I could not see anything. I was afraid that I should have gotten an L3901 but am now convinced that I can maintain my 29 acres with the 2501 and not worry about a DPF filter.

 

[coreyperez]

Well I took delivery of the 2501 today. It is "smaller" in engine size than I "wanted", but frankly, being slower is probably better, and allowing me to be more deliberate with my actions.

I'm not seeing myself doing any real heavy PTO work, here in Alaska, there just isn't really any cleared land that I need to worry about mowing, etc. Most of my work will be clearing (trees) and then years down the road, possibly mowing, but probably not. With the 2501 and 3000 series all having the same lifting capability I didn't feel like I was losing out.

All in all it was a bit more expensive than I hoped to spend (when talking to the guys in the lower 48), but with the full HST, Ultra UDT fluid upgrade (cold temps), the R4 tires, grapple, 3rd point hydro and quick release, I'm sure I'll get what I need out of it.

I've already ticked .2 on the hour meter. My boys "needed" a ride on the "snow speeder (Star Wars)".

Be expecting a bunch more questions from me in the near future! I'm going to be putting on the 3rd point hydro this weekend (also fighting for garage space with a yard/garage sale).

Corey