Methonol and water vs rim guard

shelkol

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I had an old Farmall Model H. Didn't have the capability to do CaCl at the time so used just plain water. It froze in the tires and when you were plowing you could feel the serge as the air spot in the tire went round.

It worked well enough for me, until ... A friend was doing some yard work with it and the sidewall blew out and covered him with smelly rotten water. Wish I was there to see that :)
 

GeoHorn

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Filling tires with nitrogen is one of the biggest rip offs in the industry
The local auto dealers are getting all hyped up about selling it to dummies. The Jeep dealer I bought from has a poster in the waiting room which always is an attention-getter... which offers to drain and refill your tires w/100% nitrogen which claims to extend tire life, improve gas mileage, and make you sexy all for only $100.
8O


The dealership service-writer had just handed that brochure and sales-pitch to the housewife sitting next to me in the waiting room …and then he walked away to get his clipboard.

The housewife was about to order that service when I asked her if she'd studied science in high-school. When she replied "YES"...I asked if she remembered how much of the atmosphere is made up of nitrogen, how much oxygen, and how much carbon-dioxide and other gases. She looked puzzled, so I reminded her that in round-numbers, 80% of the atmosphere was nitrogen and the oxygen made up most of the other 20% with a few other gases thrown in.
I then pointed out that...if the poster was correct in stating that nitrogen in tires benefit us because it has larger molecules and did not leak out as rapidly as the other gases and therefore keeps tires properly inflated better than other gases.... I asked her if the tire was already fillled with 80% nitrogen and it becomes deflated due to the other gases leaking out... and if we re-fill it with more 80% nitrogen mix... "Isn't the concentration of nitrogen automatically and quite naturally increased without paying someone $100?"
8O
8O


You should have seen and heard the scolding that woman gave the poor service-writer when he returned with his work-order to be signed by her!
I almost felt sorry for him.
:lol:
 
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SDT

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Do you have any proof that RimGuard causes slippage or you just heard that it did? You do say you don't use it. ;)

I have a ballast box, but it's never on because it doesn't provide any capability other than weight while my Grader Scraper, Rear Blade, or Rotary Cutter can be used for other things. Most are heavier, wider, and add more stability.

I went with R4 tires, so I won't have flats or need tire repairs. RimGuard isn't an issue at all for me.

Obviously, ballast in tires plus 3 pt weight is more than only the 3 pt.
Techs (multiple) and service manager at local dealer and salesman at another dealer told me such. Tech with whom I am closest showed me tractor, B2650, IIRC, where they had confirmed such with tire pencil.

I prefer ballast boxes (have 2) because suitable sized ballast box filled with bagged playground sand is heavier than appropriately box blade, etc., and interferes with maneuverability much less.

Weight behind rear wheels much more effective as counterweight than weight on rims.

I remove all FELS in spring before mounting mowers. Reverse in fall. Ballast boxes mounted as needed.

Yes, R4 tires are subject to punctures as are R1s, R14Ts, etc.
 

jyoutz

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I'm quite familiar with calcium chloride's effects on metals and the environment. It's much less of a problem than sodium chloride, which is exactly why it's used.
It’s still very corrosive.
 
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SDT

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Tire slippage with ballasted tires usually are a result of low air pressure. PSI has to be real low before they look flat. Most people use 3pt weight/ballast to gain FEL lifting power. Ballasting tires makes it harder to roll tractor over on it's side.

View attachment 92964
Cleaning ditches with BX and air filled tires is a real white knuckles experience. Doesn't take long to order a "B" series with loaded tires.
Yes, slippage more likely with low air pressure.
 

jimh406

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Interesting that they found "one" case that the tire spun. It doesn't sound very common, and of course, there are other reason that tires spin on a wheel.

Yes, R4 tires are subject to punctures as are R1s, R14Ts, etc.
Possible, but less likely due to much stronger carcass and almost double the load capacity in many sizes. It sounds like you have a lot of punctures to invest in changing your own tires and avoiding filled tires. We do all use our tractors differently.
 

Mark_BX25D

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It’s still very corrosive.

There is no question it's corrosive. The issue I mentioned is the inflammatory language used by RimGuard. They called it, "highly corrosive". Since it is used in place of sodium chloride specifically because it is much LESS corrosive than the more common (and cheaper) sodium chloride, their use of the word, "highly" is clearly intended to exaggerate how bad it is, a dishonest pattern that is seen in all of their comparisons.
 

jyoutz

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There is no question it's corrosive. The issue I mentioned is the inflammatory language used by RimGuard. They called it, "highly corrosive". Since it is used in place of sodium chloride specifically because it is much LESS corrosive than the more common (and cheaper) sodium chloride, their use of the word, "highly" is clearly intended to exaggerate how bad it is, a dishonest pattern that is seen in all of their comparisons.
Judging from all the tractor wheels I’ve seen with calcium ballast, it will corrode the wheels. Whether or not you call that highly corrosive is a matter of opinion. I would never use it in my wheels, or at the very least, I’d have it installed inside tubes.
 

fried1765

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Judging from all the tractor wheels I’ve seen with calcium ballast, it will corrode the wheels. Whether or not you call that highly corrosive is a matter of opinion. I would never use it in my wheels, or at the very least, I’d have it installed inside tubes.
Even with tubes CaCl will eventually eat your rims.
Usually occurs first at air fill valve area.
Ask me how I know !
 
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Biker1mike

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Anyone who believes that CaCl solution is not corrosive to rims, etc., simply has not been around old tractors much.
I have four rims holding down the tarps on my wood piles. Rotted from the inside out,
 

jimh406

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There is no question it's corrosive. The issue I mentioned is the inflammatory language used by RimGuard. They called it, "highly corrosive". Since it is used in place of sodium chloride specifically because it is much LESS corrosive than the more common (and cheaper) sodium chloride, their use of the word, "highly" is clearly intended to exaggerate how bad it is, a dishonest pattern that is seen in all of their comparisons.
"highly" doesn't trigger me, fwiw. I don't find it dishonest at all. In any case, you pretty much have to buy it from a dealer, so who cares what their website says.
 

SDT

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Interesting that they found "one" case that the tire spun. It doesn't sound very common, and of course, there are other reason that tires spin on a wheel.



Possible, but less likely due to much stronger carcass and almost double the load capacity in many sizes. It sounds like you have a lot of punctures to invest in changing your own tires and avoiding filled tires. We do all use our tractors differently.
No where did I say that they found "only" one case of slipped tires. That said, I was shown only one such circumstance because I happened to be in the shop while the subject tractor was.
 

jimh406

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No where did I say that they found "only" one case of slipped tires. That said, I was shown only one such circumstance because I happened to be in the shop while the subject tractor was.
My point, it seems you are implying a significant issue. I'm just not buying it with one example from one dealer. Ok if you do.
 

cthomas

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Filling tires with nitrogen is one of the biggest rip offs in the industry
As a tech I have seen nitro-filled(from new) have less corrosion on the rims that should be cleaned off when changing tires. Also had a very sllllooooowwww leak on the lawn mower. Used to fill it every 2 weeks, filled with nitrogen and now its every 2 months(fill 3 times and then done mowing for season). As how the nitrogen is filled the machine I used would fill then deflate the tire 3 times. For the twenty-fours dollars the dealership charged for 4 tires(lifetime fill even if you get new tires) it is worth it in my opinion. Also have seen tires slip for a lot of reasons(too much lube/wrong kind of lube when installing, customer with corvette spinning their tires as he was leaving (that I just installed and told him to take it easy for few days, rims too wide for the tires.
 
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lugbolt

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I use methanol at 99.9% in the race car, for fuel. That's what it is-a motor fuel (and a solvent) and it works good for both. One major reason I don't like it for ballast is that it's flammable and you cannot see the flame in the daytime, at night you can see a faint blue flame from pure (99.5%+) methanol but during the day it is invisible. Secondly, there is pressure inside the tire which is exactly what happens inside an engine, air and fuel are pressurized before it is ignited, and when it does ignite, it expands rapidly. So basically you have sort of a bomb inside your tire. Think about that next time you drive kinda close to a burn pile, or if you drive INTO the burn pile. I've seen tractors die or stop while very close to burn pile (burns the battery cable, snags a cable, brush snags a fuel line etc) and I certainly wouldn't want methanol near a fire. Make fire bigger. And if you're standing in a puddle of it and it ignites you will burn up and never see the flame. But hey the good news is, you can put methanol fire out with water unlike gas/diesel, so in that sense and in that sense only, it's less dangerous. Yes I'm aware that it's mixed with water for ballast and that does reduce some of the tendencies for danger but it's still methanol which is a "dry" fuel, and can aid in corrosion and degradation of rims, tires, and valve stems. Old boss used to push a lot of it because it was cheap but although cheap initially, it became expensive later on when a rim was rusted prematurely or a tire basically fell apart while still in warranty. Dealer had to eat that stuff. They then switched to antifreeze/water mix and that would freeze up in cold days causing an uncontrollable tractor if driven at any speeds (like down a road). Rim guard is probably about the best for this application with all things considered.
 

jyoutz

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I use methanol at 99.9% in the race car, for fuel. That's what it is-a motor fuel (and a solvent) and it works good for both. One major reason I don't like it for ballast is that it's flammable and you cannot see the flame in the daytime, at night you can see a faint blue flame from pure (99.5%+) methanol but during the day it is invisible. Secondly, there is pressure inside the tire which is exactly what happens inside an engine, air and fuel are pressurized before it is ignited, and when it does ignite, it expands rapidly. So basically you have sort of a bomb inside your tire. Think about that next time you drive kinda close to a burn pile, or if you drive INTO the burn pile. I've seen tractors die or stop while very close to burn pile (burns the battery cable, snags a cable, brush snags a fuel line etc) and I certainly wouldn't want methanol near a fire. Make fire bigger. And if you're standing in a puddle of it and it ignites you will burn up and never see the flame. But hey the good news is, you can put methanol fire out with water unlike gas/diesel, so in that sense and in that sense only, it's less dangerous. Yes I'm aware that it's mixed with water for ballast and that does reduce some of the tendencies for danger but it's still methanol which is a "dry" fuel, and can aid in corrosion and degradation of rims, tires, and valve stems. Old boss used to push a lot of it because it was cheap but although cheap initially, it became expensive later on when a rim was rusted prematurely or a tire basically fell apart while still in warranty. Dealer had to eat that stuff. They then switched to antifreeze/water mix and that would freeze up in cold days causing an uncontrollable tractor if driven at any speeds (like down a road). Rim guard is probably about the best for this application with all things considered.
My dealer installed a new product named bio ballast. He says they like it better than rim guard.

 

DustyRusty

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I am thinking of using helium in my tires so I have a floating feeling as the tractor traverses over bumps.
 
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edritchey

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I used rim guards locator and called the dealer that came up they quoted me 1700 plus delivery and tax WOW almost 2k to get a couple 17.5x24s filled lol I don't think so.
 
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GreensvilleJay

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funny... I go to Rimgaurd's website, while waiting for 'snowmaggedon to come here...)
IF they'd filled in their comparison chart HONESTLY, the world would see that external weights are as good as rimguard ! They should have 4 green check marks NOT 2 red xs and 2 blanks.

their wording of 'highly' corrosive is true relative to their beet juice, it's 'mild' compared to H2S04 though !

hmm wonder how much water you need to add to meth to make it 'nonflammable' ?
 

fried1765

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I used rim guards locator and called the dealer that came up they quoted me 1700 plus delivery and tax WOW almost 2k to get a couple 17.5x24s filled lol I don't think so.
Probably about $200 total cost with windhield washer fluid.
 
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