L5240 needs an engine

[Fedup]

I got into another "sweetheart" of a project yesterday. I agreed to R&R a bad engine. Not sure how badly damaged it is, but we know it has a hole in the pan, and certainly ran a while with little to no oil in it. The owners are looking at options, like having it rebuilt, buying new, a reman exchange, or whatever might be possible.

Question is how to identify what it is in order to search out a replacement. The engine isn't completely out on the floor yet, but I've exposed much of the exterior and don't see any I.D. marks, numbers, etc. Only a casting number on the block 2.4340 This probably doesn't mean much. The engine has an injection pump with electrical harness plugs, but it's not truly computer controlled. It does have EGR so I'm guessing it's probably tier 3 emissions wise?

The tractor is HST cab 4WD, the serial number tag on the frame is damaged so the only numbers visible are the first three 705

What information other than physical description would be needed to try and locate an exchange engine?

 

[North Idaho Wolfman]

Look on the valve cover for numbers printed on a label.

Or look on the Block right outside the injection pump stamped into a flat spot will be size and serial number.

It's a V2403

 

[200mph]

For what it is worth, the wholegoods price (Sept 2018) list has the following. Also keep in mind there are two submodels for the Grand L40 series. Early models were L5240-1 and newer models L5240-3. In some cases it is important to distinguish dash number.

(copy/paste from wholegoods)
Series: L
Model: V2403T2HST
Description: REPL ENG FOR L5240HST/HSTC
Dealer NetL 4,340.70

Series: L
Model: V2403TE3H
Description: REPL ENG FOR L5240HST/HSTC
Dealer Net: 4,470.96

 

[Fedup]

Thanks. I will look today and see what I find. I didn't see a sticker on the valve cover so I need to look closer around the injection pump.

 

[Fedup]

Finally got the engine out and on the floor today. Found the sticker on the valve cover tucked under a hose leading to the turbo intake hose. The number reads V2403-M-T-ET04. Local Deere/Kubota dealer quoted seven grand plus for a new engine with one year warranty. Seems like rebuilding it should run less than that. Will see what they decide.

 

[200mph]

Be cautious when consulting Kubota with prices. The document I referenced above was from Wholegoods. This is not the same price parts would quote for the same identical item.

I'm not saying the $7 grand isn't correct. Just to be positive they are deriving the price from wholegoods. If in doubt ask a sales person to look up the replacement engine in the wholegoods price list.

Also don't assume the dealer will look out for your best interest in this matter either.

 

[lugbolt]

you gotta jump through hoops and bend over backwards for kubota to send a new engine.....you have been warned.

rebuilding it, if the block and crank is damaged beyond reasonable repair, costs about as much as replacing it. Parts aren't cheap for them. They are very tough engines but not indestructible. BTW figure on replacing the turbo as well, if the engine has been run out of oil. That particular turbocharger runs upwards of 225,000 RPM shaft speed (the maximum rated is 241,000), it doesn't take long for it to cook itself and it's not always easily identifiable. They can be rebuilt but a truck shop isn't the right place for a rebuild on a teeny tiny turbocharger. You need a turbo repair facility that will properly balance the assembly. Most truck shops just get it kinda close and send it, because what they generally mess with is 5x the size and turn a whole lot less shaft speed.

there was a recall at one point on some of the turbo hoses. Call dealer with serial number and ask them for any campaigns for that tractor. If there is, you'll have to reassemble the tractor for them to do it, they no longer give parts away and let you do it. Kubota's policy. The turbo hose campaign doesn't cause engine failure. Just blows the hose off or breaks it and the turbo overspeeds and engine performance suffers obviously.

engine serial number is near the injection pump. That area is usually painted over quite well and the serial number is hard to see through the paint. You will need to know where that number is when/if you get ready to order a new engine

 

[GreensvilleJay]

I have to ask... what's the tractor really worth ?? Assuming an engine( complete ? drop in ?/) is $4K, add another $1K for stuff, and $3K for labour... there's $8K more or less.
Maybe a 'bits and pieces' rebuild would be cheaper vs a complete 'drop inand go' engine ,if, IF ! ALL the bits CAN be delivered. I can forsee that 'this ' hose or only 4 of 5 rings are stocked...maybe 5-7 MONTH backorder( parts come from Japan ??). Just think you should look at options, like a 'donor' tractor, if they exist....
I know when the Buda diesel in my forklift finally says 'not today', I'm NOT pulling it and giving 5K to the rebuilder ! I've made 'alternate engine' plans.....

 

[Fedup]

What's it worth??? I don't really have an answer to that. It's not my tractor. What's the cost of down time to the business while discussing options, making choices, and then waiting for whatever results those choices bring? Again, that's not my call. It's a construction type business, often working two or more job sites, usually with multiple pieces of equipment at each. Seems there's always one or two sitting unused at each site whenever I've had occasion to visit one.

I was surprised when looking at parts lists for this engine. There is a serial number break on the crankshaft. The earlier numbered engines used a crank that seems to be available from multiple sources for $1000 or less. Must be a common enough part that aftermarket suppliers make it, or maybe used ones are just more plentiful. Don't know, just guessing. The later crank (which this engine has) is more like three grand. I have to wonder what the difference is between the two.

 

[Fedup]

Just a quick update here. A new engine was ordered, received, and installed. Problem solved.

I finally had time today to dig into the bad motor. It had indeed spun one rod bearing but that truly seems to be the only real damage sustained. (Other than the hole I had to drill through the block). I plan to take the crank to a local engine rebuilder for inspection to see if he thinks a grinding can save it. If so I guess we will try to find a home for it along with any of the other stuff. Still a lot of good parts there for someone who needs or wants them. Had they chosen to take the time I'm quite sure the engine could have been saved, but here we are.

 

[Pau7220]

A new engine was ordered, received, and installed. Problem solved.

Just curious if it was available at the wholegoods price.

 

[200mph]

I'm also curious about what type of hoops you needed to jump through to obtain it.

Ditto on the wholegoods price mentioned in post above.

 

[Fedup]

The engine came through the local Kubota dealership. I'm not sure exactly where it was shipped from, but it was in country. The price I was quoted from the dealer parts counter at the beginning of all this $7300 plus. I don't remember exactly. There were two figures quoted, both within $50 of each other, based on some aspect I don't remember now. I haven't seen any invoices but I could get the numbers if I ask.

The stipulation was to remove the cylinder head, drill a hole through the block into a cylinder near the injection pump. Insert a screwdriver or some tool through the hole and photograph both the tool and the block serial number in the same shot. Said photo had to be submitted, probably through the dealer, to Kubota before the new engine would be shipped. This was done and the process moved on.

The new engine came complete with bell housing, flywheel, water pump, thermostat, fuel system, and all that. Pretty much everything except the starter, alternator, and fan belt. It had been run (I assume it had been on a dyno but didn't confirm that), drained of fluids, and crated. When the tractor was assembled, new oil and coolant installed, it started and ran with no leaks or issues.

 

[200mph]

It might have been worth contacting the Sales group and not sales, so the "Wholegoods" price was quoted and not the "Parts" price. There is typically a big difference.

Glad you're back and running and thank you for posting the outcome and other questions.

 

[lugbolt]

they did the destruction properly hopefully they documented it properly too

the epa mandates it-the thought process is that if the old engine is "destroyed" it can no longer be used. They don't want old diesels to ever be used again

dealer is also supposed to document it being scrapped but that has loopholes

 

[Fedup]

I can understand the "seek and destroy" mentality of those who get to make the rules these days. They can't allow one to purchase an engine such as this that might end up in a NEWER tractor thus eliminating any of their precious emissions requirements. I have heard nothing yet concerning any confirmation of scrapping. Seems that would have been mentioned by now if it's "part of the package". Most likely the bulk of it will be scrapped anyway. The block is now done for, the crank may well be, (don't really know that yet). As for the head, cams, gear train, and all the other moving parts, I see nothing wrong with any of that. I have no use for any of it, and have no practical way of storing it so it will all become junk at some point anyway. Maybe the crank and flywheel could be used as a stand for a bench grinder. I'll probably keep the fuel related parts(pumps, lines, fittings, etc) for a while. I may find a use for some of that.

 

[Pau7220]

It might have been worth contacting the Sales group and not sales, so the "Wholegoods" price was quoted and not the "Parts" price. There is typically a big difference.

200, the wholegoods thing has come up before when members are searching for tires, wheels, etc. When you say sales group, you are referring to the (tractor/ implement) salesmen vs the guys at parts counter?

 

[200mph]

Paul7220,

Yes, Wholegoods is the document/price sheet used by the sales department where one would buy the tractor/implement/etc.

Typically wholegoods are kits or the options selected during equipment purchase. They include instructions and all parts to install at a substantially reduced cost over purchasing each item through the parts department.

example:
wholegoods sells the tire/wheel/valve stem as an assembly while parts will sell 3 part numbers and you’ll have to assemble.

Wholegoods = Equipment sales department.

Hope this helps.

 

[Pau7220]

Paul7220,

Yes, Wholegoods is the document/price sheet used by the sales department where one would buy the tractor/implement/etc.

Typically wholegoods are kits or the options selected during equipment purchase. They include instructions and all parts to install at a substantially reduced cost over purchasing each item through the parts department.

example:
wholegoods sells the tire/wheel/valve stem as an assembly while parts will sell 3 part numbers and you’ll have to assemble.

Wholegoods = Equipment sales department.

Hope this helps.

It did... thank you

 

[wgator]

It might have been worth contacting the Sales group and not sales, so the "Wholegoods" price was quoted and not the "Parts" price. There is typically a big difference.

Glad you're back and running and thank you for posting the outcome and other questions.

This is from my 2016 L Series wholegoods list:
L-SERIES REPLACEMENT ENGINES
(All Engines are Fully Assembled and Run Tested)
Effective June 2, 2014 all engines must be ordered through the Parts Department.
See Parts Bulletin DPB-2014-011 R01.