Why does this happen on a long weekend?

[Curt]

Hi folks

I hope someone might be able to help me - I know it will be Tuesday at the earliest before I can even speak to my dealer and probably a week after that before a service tech gets here.

I have a B2620 with 65 hours on it. I had big plans to get some work done starting this afternoon and going through the long weekend. I have had absolutely no problems with the tractor - and about 3:00pm (Friday July 1) it started up fine as usual.

I was working for about 20 minutes and shut it off to talk to my son - and that was it. It would not start, it won't turn over. I turn the key - but the starter does not turn.

It seems to have power - the lights work, the glow light symbol comes on when I try to start it.

I checked, rechecked, triple checked the position of all switches/levers, and had an engineer buddy (who has a new BX25) do the same. We each checked all the fuses and they are fine.I tried jumping it just in case the battery was low - but that did nothing leading me to believe the battery is fine.

Any ideas - any common problems I might be able to fix myself? Like I said - its not the PTO switch. That is in the middle position where it belongs.

Thank you for taking the time to read this - and have a safe and happy 4th of July!!!!!

 

[bruceatlam]

What's teh battery voltage? Should be about 13.2-13.6 fully charged -- 12.0 won't start the tractor. Watch your meter as you turn the key ---- voltage should drop to no less than 12.0. You may just need a new battery.

If that's not it, check your battery terminals and your ground --- they all need to be nice and clean and tight.

 

[kuboman]

Hi folks

I hope someone might be able to help me - I know it will be Tuesday at the earliest before I can even speak to my dealer and probably a week after that before a service tech gets here.

I have a B2620 with 65 hours on it. I had big plans to get some work done starting this afternoon and going through the long weekend. I have had absolutely no problems with the tractor - and about 3:00pm (Friday July 1) it started up fine as usual.

I was working for about 20 minutes and shut it off to talk to my son - and that was it. It would not start, it won't turn over. I turn the key - but the starter does not turn.

It seems to have power - the lights work, the glow light symbol comes on when I try to start it.

I checked, rechecked, triple checked the position of all switches/levers, and had an engineer buddy (who has a new BX25) do the same. We each checked all the fuses and they are fine.I tried jumping it just in case the battery was low - but that did nothing leading me to believe the battery is fine.

Any ideas - any common problems I might be able to fix myself? Like I said - its not the PTO switch. That is in the middle position where it belongs.

Thank you for taking the time to read this - and have a safe and happy 4th of July!!!!!

If you don't even get a starter click then it will be one of the lockout switches. I would start with the seat switch and just start bypassing them all.
Make extra sure that a pto or foot pedal is not out of position.

 

[meanjean]

Clean the grounds.

 

[Stone]

You may want to double check the wires on your starter. I believe there is a positive wire bolted and also a wire with a quick connect just behind that. Double check that both are clean and tight. Also, there should be a fuse right at your starter, double check that.

Good Luck.

 

[Curt]

Thanks guys

I really appreciate the input.

I do not have a voltage meter - but I tried jumping the tractor with my truck and another vehicle yesterday and again today, with no effect what so ever, so I am thinking its not the battery.

I have checked all the safety switches/level positions, and played with them for roughly 2 hours - nothing.

I checked all the fuses including the separate starter fuse, they are all fine. The wiring on the starter looks fine (it's basically a brand new tractor). The connections are tight.

It ran fine yesterday til I shut it off momentarily to talk to my son. 30 seconds later.... nothing. Prior to that I have had no problems what so ever. Had the dealer do the 50 hour check - I'm now at 65 hours.

 

[Theekillerbee]

Sounds like a safety switch isn't working. Without a voltage meter it will be hard to test them. You can try the old short out the starter solenoid with a screwdriver, but if there is a fuel shutoff solenoid that is also off, it won't start, but at least it will turn over.

 

[Kubota_Man]

I am no expert by any means.....With that said my BX24 had a simular issue. I ended up having my PTO engage lever safty switch go out of adjustment. I would check the safty switch engagements and see if all safty switches are being engaged properly. Just a thought.

 

[firejunkie]

First try to jump the starter by using a wire (not a screwdriver!) take a piece of wire (14-16 gauge) and put a terminal on the end the same as the start terminal on the starter solenoid (most likely a blade type connection). Attach it to the start terminal, and using the other end of the wire touch it to Batter terminal of the starter, it should try to start (it will spark a bit but you can get it to turn once or twice) if it does continue on.

You really need a voltage meter (or a test light)to help with the rest, you can buy a cheap one at Harbor freight or a auto parts store. Test your voltage at the start terminal wire, your + test lead on the wire and the other to ground, then (this helps if you have someone else around) try to start the unit, you should see 12v at the start terminal, if you do go to plan A, if you don't go to plan B.

Plan A
with voltage at that terminal you have a ground issue, try hooking up your jumper wires to the starter itself, + wire on the battery terminal of the starter and - wire onto the the starter itself, if it starts your issue is aground from engine to ground, if not take the - wire and ground it to the chassis, if it starts the your issue is a chassis ground somewhere.

Plan B
with no voltage you have either a start switch issue(key switch) or a safety switch issue, most of your neutral safety switches(pto, drive etc) will have a switch of some sort on the linkage somewhere, check to see if they are engaged, (I just reach down and try to trip the switch by hand to hear it click). Some maybe internal and you may have to rock the unit back and forth a few times to put it neutral. Also your seat switch may not work right a quick thing I do (this is fun too) is bounce up a down a few time on the seat and see if that works (sometimes they stick) you can also by pass either buy disconnecting it, or by connecting the two wires together, this will at least get it started (if it is the switch) to move it, or get it to the dealer, but do not leave it bypassed!

 

[Curt]

To everyone

THANK YOU!!!! You collectively salvaged my weekend!!!! I was able to jump start it exactly as Firejunkie suggested and it ran no problem. It still won't start with the key but at least I can get my weekend work done - and if it takes 2 weeks for the dealer to get here - its not a big deal.

Not that it matters - but I did get a volt meter and it was well above 12 volts (12.7 at the lowest)

Thanks again!

Curt

 

[firejunkie]

Glad I could help, I know how frustrating it can be when you have stuff to do and the time to do it and then,BAM! something goes wrong and messes everything up.

 

[Kytim]

Just a FYI... full charge should be approaching 13.5V. a batt that displays 12V usually has a dead cell if it had been being charged. So Iffin it was me, I would pull cables one evening and charge slowly on low overnight. recheck after charging. this could be a troubleshooting point here. low voltage= bad batt, good voltage (13.5V) = more investigation needed into charging circuit. ie, cable ends, gen voltage output, system grounds, etc. then check all the safety interlocks as they prevent proper starting through the grounds I think.

Just a few idear's, may have another period of madness later.

 

[Curt]

Thanks Kytim - I think it was down to 12.7 from 2 days of trying unsuccessfully to reposition switches and see if it would start.

 

[tiger9297]

I SWEAR i thought stuff like that only happened to ME!

 

[Theekillerbee]

Curt, glad you got it working, even if it is mickey moused. I'm sure one of the safety switches is bad. They have way too many on there if you ask me, but that is my not so humble opinion.

Firejunkie, not sure why you don't agree with the screwdriver method. I've started lots of different vehicles that way without any damage at all. What you suggested works, and is pretty much the same thing, just gotta get fancy with the wire connectors with your method. All you are doing is forcing the solenoid to work, either trick works, so the end game is the same.

 

[firejunkie]

Curt, glad you got it working, even if it is mickey moused. I'm sure one of the safety switches is bad. They have way too many on there if you ask me, but that is my not so humble opinion.

Firejunkie, not sure why you don't agree with the screwdriver method. I've started lots of different vehicles that way without any damage at all. What you suggested works, and is pretty much the same thing, just gotta get fancy with the wire connectors with your method. All you are doing is forcing the solenoid to work, either trick works, so the end game is the same.

The reason I say that is for safety, if the screw driver shorts to ground, or gets arced from a short in the starter, you may not be able to get it off, and could get hurt or start a fire, I have seen it happen 12 times in 25 years. Not worth the risk, if you a have a wire attached to the start terminal, and touch a ground by accident you will not short anything. In my profession and my hobby I hear "I've done it like this for years" all the time, same people get killed when Murphy's law comes knocking.

 

[Eric McCarthy]

YEP I love a good old fashioned mechanical tractor that doesnt have that the pain in the ass safty switches this and headache buttons that! If my old Kubota did that I'da just gave the starter a good firm tap with a hammer and that usually gets it going!

These days starter motors are remanufactured and you can get a bad one every now and then. I had to replaces a stater motor on a Pontiac Grandam and went to NAPA twice cause they we're faulty starters.

 

[Theekillerbee]

Fair enough firejunkie. There is a lot of power in a battery, I've seen it melt weak jumper cables.

 

[Butch]

hey Bee you are right... a battery has a lot of fire power. Case in point... my brother and I was working on a well drilling rig in the dead of winter in the mountains of WV. We tented the drilling platform from the wind and proceeded to light an orchard heater to stay warm. Neither of us smoked so no lighters or matches. Rob decided to arc a hacksaw blade across the rig's 12 volt battery.... get it red hot and start a paper fire to ignite the used oil fuel in the heater. The first two trys did not work... on the third try I heard an hellacous explosion over the roar of the rig.

You guessed it the hydrogen ignited,,, blew the battery, whereas sulfuric acid sprayed all over my brother. after making sure it was off his skin and not in his eyes. we spsnt the rest of the day counting holes in his clothes.

Not one of our more brighter moves... but on the we were only 13 and 14 years old at the time. Dad and granpaw went to the second rig that day after dropping us off.... pop was pissed about the battery.

In 1957 there was no laws in WV about family business and child labor. That is a Saturday we won't forget....

 

[Ed Hill]

I have in the past been confounded by equipment that would not start, and it generally turned out to be a loose battery connection. I suggest that you remove and clean both battery terminals and while you have them off, check the ground connection to be sure it is tight. More than once I had Good Sam road service out and the problem was only a poor connection at the battery. The simplest problem is the one to look for first.