Tie down points on L3800

[dmanlyr]

Really as far as transport goes alot of it boils down to OSHA and DOT laws. Yeah laws are different all across the land. DOT laws are pretty much universal across the land. Even with that I think the DOT man makes up bullshit laws as he sees fit just to charge you with something. I got fined 85 bucks because my bed wasn't made in the bunk and the DOT man bitched because he didn't know how long ago it was that I last went to sleep. I told him that info is written down in the log book. But he popped me with a fine anyway.

Good thing I showed him the "right" log book LMAO.

I agree on the over zealous DOT inspectors. One of our drivers was fined because his safety gear (triangles / flares) was under his bunk and not "readily available" Um, ya that leaves a lot of latitude. Exactly what is considered "readily available"?

I mean really - did he have to have them at arms reach at all times so as he was pulling over he could toss them out the window and deploy them?

But I suspect it was more than this. It turns out that some of our drivers have been driving by the way stations as of late, primarily in the F250's thru F450's non cdl license required, but over 16k licensed weight that are now required to stop as the state of WA has a 16k and up "trucks must stop at weigh stations" law now.

Due to this, I would suspect that some of the smaller outlying weigh stations have a look out for us now.

Kinda like a previous company I worked for that had a "conditional" DOT rating, we were always stopped and inspected as our reputation preceded us.... !

So far so good, I have never failed a inspection. Fingers crossed!

David

 

[Eric McCarthy]

The CDL manual here in Virginia is as clear as mud. Any truck over 26,001 yes you see that correct twenty six thousand and one pound. Towing 10,000lbs or more requires a CDL.

Now like you said the F350's and F450's can handle well over 15-20k and here in Va those trucks do not require a CDL nor do they have to scale.

I know travelling threw Maryland F350's and F450's are required to carry a CDL and have a US DOT number posted some where in plane site at all times.

I quickly learned how to dodge the scales and went around them since I pretty much stayed over loaded like a mofo all the time.

 

[dmanlyr]

WA state is close to the same on CDL licensing requirements as to 26001lbs and above B endorsement and when a 10001lbs trailer is pulled in a combination totaling over 26000lbs, or if a 10001lbs trailer is being pulled by a class B truck defined as 26001lbs and above, a class A endorsement is required.

The main point of confusion is on the F250's, F350's and F450's when driven by non cdl drivers. The F250's carry a license of 18k, the F350's are at 20k and some of the F450's are up at 24k, well below of course that 26001 lbs that requires a cdl B endorsement.

So to recap, even if the trailer is over 10001lbs, in WA there is no cdl A endorsement required if the combined weight of the rig is less than 26001lbs.

We at times tow 10 - 14k trailers, depending upon the truck, the year and the rating behind these trucks, which is why the high licensing, all of course within Ford's stated recommended GCWR's. WA state requires the "powered" part of the combination to carry enough weight licensing for the entire rig as WA state does not do trailer weight fees separately.

So it has been a learning curve in this state not only for those non cdl drivers who are not used to stopping at scales, but also for the weigh station operators getting used to pickups coming thru the scales.

This has required changing of signs for example - at one time all scales in WA were marked "commercial vehicles only" then they added the requirement that all vehicles 16k and above stop, as well as have Federal DOT numbers.... without thinking the while thing thru. What about people like me? I have a personal use dump truck - 36k licensed. But since it was not in "commercial use" (as defined by being in commerce - per FMCSA, or for hire) hence no DOT numbers were required again per FMCSA rules, and not being defined as "commercial" I was breaking the law by stopping. Yet, I was also breaking the law by not stopping. Either way I was breaking the law. Many calls to the state patrol by myself and others I would imagine finally straightened it out. The signs saying commercial vehicles only are now removed.

The education is continuing though - We still have weigh station operators that think private non commerce vehicles 16k and above need Federal DOT numbers though - I now carry the rules with me. As well as the email from the head DOT enforcement officer in the state capital stating non commerce vehicles do not need DOT numbers, regardless of size or weight ratings.

Sometimes it makes one wonder.

David

 

[Bulldog]

Dmanlyr, is your dump truck equiped with air brakes?
If so in Ga. even if it's for private use only CDL's would be required.
In addition to that if it's weight exceeds 26,001 lbs CDL's are required.

 

[Eric McCarthy]

See that's another kicker here in Virginia. If you are driving "for hire" a CDL is required. But if you own x-amount of land and are farming then you can own big rigs and put farm use tags on them and not need a CDL. Or if its your own rig and "not for hire" then you don't need a CDL either.

Which really gets confusing because here a "Farm Use" tag on a pickup truck or dump truck they consider it a piece of equipment and you can run a short distance between fields on the roads and not need an inspection sticker in the window. I think those are allowed 20-25 miles away from home. Now a "Farm Vehicle" tag you can put on pickups, dumps, and tractor trailers and those allow you to run no more then 150 miles from home so you can run between fields and haul your crop or cattle to market. With the "Farm Vehicle" tag you can put those on an 18 wheeler and not need a CDL to drive.

 

[dmanlyr]

Dmanlyr, is your dump truck equiped with air brakes?
If so in Ga. even if it's for private use only CDL's would be required.
In addition to that if it's weight exceeds 26,001 lbs CDL's are required.

Yes it has the optional HD air brakes. I would NOT own nor drive it in todays fast paced world and quick stopping without the HD air brakes as they have 25% more lining area than the standard hydraulic brakes.

WA state rules are -

1) If below 26001lbs, regardless of brake system (air/hydraulic) and being used in non commerce (non commercial) no special cdl license is required. Commercial uses are a little bit gray, technically only a common class c license is required, but if air brake equipped, technically a air brake endorsement is required, but since there is no such thing as a air brake endorsement from a federal rules standpoint, only a air brake restriction on a class A or B license, good luck getting one!

This one is misunderstood a lot. When you get a CDL, at least from a federal rules perspective, not passing the air brake portion puts a restriction on the CDL license.

2) If 26001lbs and above, a class B cdl is required regardless of private or commercial - BUT and this is a big BUT, other than drivers cdl licensing requirements, NONE of the other commercial truck rules apply. No hours of service, no dot inspections etc. In other words while a commercial drivers license is required, the truck itself from a regulation and licensing standpoint is not considered a commercial rig.

3) If 26001lbs and above, private or commercial and air brake equipped, then you must not have a air brake restriction. Again, if private use, then anyone can work on the air brake system, not just a certified air brake tech as would be required if the truck was used commercially in commerce.

4) If a trailer weighs more than 10000lbs (10001lbs and up) and is being towed by a Class B licensed truck (26001lbs and above) then a class A cdl is required.

Again though, if the truck is not in commerce it is not considered a commercial truck and is licensed as a private rig, including class 8 rigs. All that is required is a class A license, but no commercial DOT rules apply to the truck itself.

The whole thing boils down to one word - commerce! Not commercial nor for hire, but being used in commerce. This is true from the Federal FMCSR's as well. Commerce is in the definitions section as to what it means exactly.


David

 

[dmanlyr]

See that's another kicker here in Virginia. If you are driving "for hire" a CDL is required. But if you own x-amount of land and are farming then you can own big rigs and put farm use tags on them and not need a CDL. Or if its your own rig and "not for hire" then you don't need a CDL either.

Which really gets confusing because here a "Farm Use" tag on a pickup truck or dump truck they consider it a piece of equipment and you can run a short distance between fields on the roads and not need an inspection sticker in the window. I think those are allowed 20-25 miles away from home. Now a "Farm Vehicle" tag you can put on pickups, dumps, and tractor trailers and those allow you to run no more then 150 miles from home so you can run between fields and haul your crop or cattle to market. With the "Farm Vehicle" tag you can put those on an 18 wheeler and not need a CDL to drive.

WA state breaks down CDL's separately from DOT rules on commercial trucks. Basically, while the rules regarding a CDL is based upon the truck weight and classification, other than some farm use vehicles. But other than that, a cdl requirement to drive a certain class or weight of truck has no bearing on weither the truck itself is considered commercial or private.

So I sure understand this farm tag issue - Our farm tags are limited to 50 miles in WA, some CDL and DOT rules apply, but not all. It can get confusing, especially when the weigh station operator is used to seeing nothing but standard commercial rigs come thru, then a farm use (still considered commercial as it is in commerce) or private use truck comes thru and he/she thinks the same rules apply.

I have read thru many times and carry the Federal rule book. I have had to get it and the WA state info out on more than one occasion. But, other than one ticket that was rescinded later that day for something that the weigh station inspector goofed up on - PUC permits are required on commercial trucks in OR, but NOT on commercial trucks not in service and simply being ferried thru the state, the inspector failed to understand this. I did, I mentioned it and pointed it out in the rules, but no sense arguing to him, I went up the chain of command and was told this "that was stupid, why did he do that?"

Why? Because like all of us do at times, he made a honest mistake, I was just not willing to pay for it

Ticket rescinded, so other than that after 30+ years I have made it thru unscathed, but it has been close at times. Knowing the federal regulations as well as the states regulations where I drive inside and out has sure helped. As well as being respectful to him/her!

WA state does not have inspections other than those required for commercial rigs - annual DOT inspections. So we get a lot of bald tired unsafe junk on the road of all sizes.

David

 

[Eric McCarthy]

Well all this info is just more reason one should check with their local laws are concerned on the transporting of equipment and the required licensing. Sounds like in your neck of the woods you need a permit to wipe you own ass... GEEZZZZZ!!!

 

[dmanlyr]

Well all this info is just more reason one should check with their local laws are concerned on the transporting of equipment and the required licensing. Sounds like in your neck of the woods you need a permit to wipe you own ass... GEEZZZZZ!!!

Yes, we are getting to that point very fast. I have given serious thought about moving.

Seems that you need a permit for everything not related to over road transport as well, some communities (which I don't live in) have passed rules that even bird houses need aproval.

Yup, I am serious. We now have bird house inspectors. Well not really, but close, you have to get your birdhouse approved by the "committee".

One community even has rules against owning any car, truck that drip, leaks fluids or smokes excessively....

Seems that in certain areas, WA is turning into Commiefornia.

David

 

[Eric McCarthy]

This picture here is a prime example of go home and do it again. I'm not sure what this kat is trying to accomplish but it looks like he has chains and straps running in every direction. I have no clue what that beast is on the trailer but in my humble opinion it's not tied down correctly.

 

[Bulldog]

Looks like 2 tri-cycle front end MD Farmalls. Prime example of someone who doesn't know how to use straps or chains. Look even closer and you can see he's using a winch cable as well.

 

[Eric McCarthy]

Found that on Craigslist in my area, dude is trying to sell the trailer. Easiest and more efficient way to chain that down is 4 chains and binders and wrap the axles and cross the chains down in a X pattern front and rear.

I was taught early on when I was driving wreckers for a living to chain down crossing the chains in an X or V pattern and the load will be secure.