Replacing BX1500 power steering lines

[OhioGuy]

It appears that I have a hydraulic leak, probably in the pressure supply line power steering hose. Rains oil from somewhere above the power steering unit, when steering is fully left at the stop.

These hoses are totally buried in the cowling and beside the engine, I can't see where they begin or end.

Looks to me like the entire front cowling and maybe more has to be disassembled to get to these hoses.

Anyone familiar with this repair? Looks like this will cost $700 - $800 or more to get it done at Kubota dealer (that includes trailering).

Is a workshop manual useful, would it help me with this? I see it on Messicks for $123.

Thanks for any advice.

 

[North Idaho Wolfman]

The WSM is going to be little help on this.
This is the line routing.

 

[OhioGuy]

The WSM is going to be little help on this.
This is the line routing.
View attachment 101038

Thanks for posting this. Agree that's pretty useless, need to know the procedure/process. Not many BX1500 owners out there I guess. I could just start ripping it apart but it would be good to know in advance what I am getting into.

 

[North Idaho Wolfman]

That picture is not the WSM that's a parts diagram.
I suggest you get the WSM and make the determination yourself if it's going to help you or not.

 

[OhioGuy]

Have done a little more digging into this problem, I got the cowling off and the front plate which covers the flywheel, exposing the power steering unit and hoses very nicely.

What I found was that the power steering hose bundle had migrated up until it was in contact with the OD of the flywheel ( a really stupid design). The flywheel has eroded a small hole in the pressure hose, which is the source of the leak.

It is unlikely I can repair it (is this 2000 PSI?) but I have absolutely nothing to lose at this point. These lines appear to be extremely difficult to replace, since they run through a small hole in the frame and terminate up under the dash. Not sure I want to tackle that.

I can think of two things to try to repair it.

1) Get some high quality oil resistant RTV permatex, dress the leak point with RTV, wrap rubber hose around the smaller power steering hose at the leak point compressing the RTV, and tight the crap out of this assembly with 2 hose clamps. Let it cure and see what happens.

2) Cut the hose in two at the leak point, find a couple fitting with two barbed ends, push them into the hose to make a coupling, and tighten the crap out of them with hose clamps. I have never seen this coupling, but guessing something similar is out their. Not sure of the hose ID, it's probably 1/4 inch or so.

Has anyone ever tried repairing a high pressure hydraulic hose like this? Any other ideas?

I see there are some hydraulic hose repair kits out there, but not sure if there is room for one.

 

[TheOldHokie]

Have done a little more digging into this problem, I got the cowling off and the front plate which covers the flywheel, exposing the power steering unit and hoses very nicely.

What I found was that the power steering hose bundle had migrated up until it was in contact with the OD of the flywheel ( a really stupid design). The flywheel has eroded a small hole in the pressure hose, which is the source of the leak.

It is unlikely I can repair it (is this 2000 PSI?) but I have absolutely nothing to lose at this point. These lines appear to be extremely difficult to replace, since they run through a small hole in the frame and terminate up under the dash. Not sure I want to tackle that.

I can think of two things to try to repair it.

1) Get some high quality oil resistant RTV permatex, dress the leak point with RTV, wrap rubber hose around the smaller power steering hose at the leak point compressing the RTV, and tight the crap out of this assembly with 2 hose clamps. Let it cure and see what happens.

2) Cut the hose in two at the leak point, find a couple fitting with two barbed ends, push them into the hose to make a coupling, and tighten the crap out of them with hose clamps. I have never seen this coupling, but guessing something similar is out their. Not sure of the hose ID, it's probably 1/4 inch or so.

Has anyone ever tried repairing a high pressure hydraulic hose like this? Any other ideas?

I see there are some hydraulic hose repair kits out there, but not sure if there is room for one.

Power steering pressure is typically around 1200 PSI. On a tractor that size it might be a little lower. Do yourself a favor and replace the hose.

Dan

 

[OhioGuy]

Power steering pressure is typically around 1200 PSI. On a tractor that size it might be a little lower. Do yourself a favor and replace the hose.

Dan

That favor will cost me at least $800 so I will try to repair it first, I have nothing to lose. These hoses are routed through the frame in such a way to require major disassembly to replace.

 

[JimDeL]

...I can think of two things to try to repair it.

1) Get some high quality oil resistant RTV permatex, dress the leak point with RTV, wrap rubber hose around the smaller power steering hose at the leak point compressing the RTV, and tight the crap out of this assembly with 2 hose clamps. Let it cure and see what happens.

2) Cut the hose in two at the leak point, find a couple fitting with two barbed ends, push them into the hose to make a coupling, and tighten the crap out of them with hose clamps. I have never seen this coupling, but guessing something similar is out their. Not sure of the hose ID, it's probably 1/4 inch or so.

Has anyone ever tried repairing a high pressure hydraulic hose like this? Any other ideas?

I see there are some hydraulic hose repair kits out there, but not sure if there is room for one.

1) Just ain't gonna work. It'll blow out in a minute (or less).
2) Might work, but it'll be almost as much work to do as replacing the whole hose.

3) Bite the bullet and just replace the hose. Peace of mind in the long run.

 

[PoTreeBoy]

That favor will cost me at least $800 so I will try to repair it first, I have nothing to lose. These hoses are routed through the frame in such a way to require major disassembly to replace.

I think the only possible in-line repair for that is to use field attachable fittings. You'd probably need to use a JIC male and a JIC female coupled together. They aren't cheap and you may not have room. After 20 years, you may be on borrowed time with those hoses.

 

[TheOldHokie]

I think the only possible in-line repair for that is to use field attachable fittings. You'd probably need to use a JIC male and a JIC female coupled together. They aren't cheap and you may not have room. After 20 years, you may be on borrowed time with those hoses.

Not killervexpensive. About $100 for two fittings but they are very application specific. He would have to identify exactly what type hose he is repairing - e.g. R1, R2, or something a bit more exotic ...

Dan

 

[North Idaho Wolfman]

Best choice replace hoses!

None of the repairs that you state will work, they will fail, period!

As Dan stated, you will have to know exactly what the hose your working with is!

Field-Attachable (Reusable) Hose Fittings

Field-attachable hose fittings are assembled without a hose crimper, making them an excellent choice for emergency repairs. A properly assembled hose with reusable hose fittings will meet all applicable SAE specifications.

www.discounthydraulichose.com

 

[Henro]

That favor will cost me at least $800 so I will try to repair it first,

Where does the $800 come from? I replaced both hoses on my BX2200 and it did not break the bank.

 

[JimDeL]

Where does the $800 come from? I replaced both hoses on my BX2200 and it did not break the bank.

I wondered about that, too. My local Hydraulic shop (BDI Inc.) will make up both hoses for under $200.

 

[TheOldHokie]

I wondered about that, too. My local Hydraulic shop (BDI Inc.) will make up both hoses for under $200.

I would make them for half that. But his problem is the job of replaceing them is to much for him and he has to pay a dealer to do the job = $800.

Dan

 

[OhioGuy]

Best choice replace hoses!

None of the repairs that you state will work, they will fail, period!

As Dan stated, you will have to know exactly what the hose your working with is!

Field-Attachable (Reusable) Hose Fittings

Field-attachable hose fittings are assembled without a hose crimper, making them an excellent choice for emergency repairs. A properly assembled hose with reusable hose fittings will meet all applicable SAE specifications.

www.discounthydraulichose.com

Those experiments will cost me about $20. I have plenty of time on my hands and nothing to lose. I give them no better than a 50/50. We will see.

If they fail, we bite the bullet and cough up the big $$$ to have Kubota dealer do it. Or tear this whole tractor apart and install them myself.

Will report back one way or the other. I was surprised to hear that this system is only 1200 PSI, I thought it was quite a bit higher than that.

 

[OhioGuy]

I would make them for half that. But his problem is the job of replaceing them is to much for him and he has to pay a dealer to do the job = $800.

Dan

Kubota dealer "guessed" they could have the hoses made for $50 apiece. It's the labor and transport that takes this job to the big dollar range. Messick's has them on their site for about $35 apiece, but if they are really truly in stock and truly compatible is another question.

Here are the hoses at Messick's:

HOSE, PS LH
Part # K2511-41610
-HOSE PS LH
$32.62
5-10 business days


HOSE, PS RH
Part # K2511-41620
-HOSE PS RH
$34.86
1 in stock

 

[OhioGuy]

Where does the $800 come from? I replaced both hoses on my BX2200 and it did not break the bank.

Henro, the second dealer I spoke with was a little more reasonable. His verbal guesstimate went like this:

$150 pickup/delivery charge ( I don't have a way to transport)
$300 labor
$100 to make new hoses

So about $600 after taxes and oil. Still more than I want to spend unless it is necessary. This dealer has a reputation for being slooooow, and they are a PITA to work with.

 

[TheOldHokie]

Those experiments will cost me about $20. I have plenty of time on my hands and nothing to lose. I give them no better than a 50/50. We will see.

If they fail, we bite the bullet and cough up the big $$$ to have Kubota dealer do it. Or tear this whole tractor apart and install them myself.

Will report back one way or the other. I was surprised to hear that this system is only 1200 PSI, I thought it was quite a bit higher than that.

PS system is separate from the hydraulic system that runs at a higher pressire.

Dan

 

[OhioGuy]

PS system is separate from the hydraulic system that runs at a higher pressire.

Dan

That explains it. Thanks.

 

[GreensvilleJay]

curious..
WHY would a dealer 'make hoses for $100' when they can buy proper ones for LESS than $50 ?
at the end of the day, I'd order the hoses, then tear the tractor apart. They have to come out ,so why pay dealer an extra hour labour ?