Personal Redirect to: Water in the hydraulic fluid

[steveInMaryland]

All,

Starting a new thread because I have drained the fluid, found I was missing the stupid O-Ring on the fluid fill plug and most horrifying was that the two plugs under the differential drained out almost a LIME green fluid.

So as a advocate of these machines I now have a new problem. I decided saving the fluid is no longer an option but saving the machine is.

Questions:

Will Bioxxxxxxx work in hydraulic fluid?

Will putting a vacuum on the transmission vent cause more problems than I already have? My intention would be only turn it on when it is sunny and I'm doing something constructive with it.

Semper Fi,

 

[steveInMaryland]

Re: Pesonal Reirect to: Water in the hydraulic fluid

Forgive me for my bad English/spelling in the title. I was a little miffed plus I rolled a tire off the front of my B2710 tonight moving ice from in front of the back yard gate. Hmmmmmmm.

 

[Tooljunkie]

Re: Pesonal Reirect to: Water in the hydraulic fluid

Ok, i'm lost. By lime green do you mean there is something like prestone in there?
And the consideration is flushing with something other than hst compatible fluid?
Just trying to clarify you cloudy situation.

 

[steveInMaryland]

Re: Pesonal Reirect to: Water in the hydraulic fluid

No.

Lime green in this case is not Prestone. It's some sort of BIO. Algae, bacteria, etc. Same as you might get in Diesel.

To answer your question, if you read my other thread, I was going to try and "FIX" this super udt2 fluid. I don't think that is an option anymore although I do still have it.

This is a GST machine but I don't think it would be any different for a HST after something (water really) has gotten in.

 

[Tooljunkie]

Re: Pesonal Reirect to: Water in the hydraulic fluid

Gear transmission, fill it with somethin that suits your budget. Run for a while and when dollars suit- treat it with the good stuff.
Moisture affects the metal parrs in a similar way, pitting bearings and gear surfaces, best to get it out and flushed as soon as you can. Before change, add some kerosene and thin it before draining. Any leftover kero will evaporate out over time.

Up here in the GWN, adding kerosene in extreme cold is commonplace.as the temp rises,kerosene evaporates.

 

[North Idaho Wolfman]

Re: Pesonal Reirect to: Water in the hydraulic fluid

ToolJunkie,
I'm sorry but I'm going to have too 100% disagree with your take on it.
Here is why:
Its a GST yes geared, but hydraulically controlled, with hydraulic clutches.
Cheap fluid in a GST will cause all sorts of issues, and kerosene will fry the clutches, the clutch packs in these are $1500 some odd dollars, so not something you want to mess with.

Steve,
Same advice as before, drain it completely and replace with good fluid, something like Mysik JT5 is low cost but not cheap fluid.

DO NOT put a vacuum on the vent unless you want to suck all the seals right out of the machine!

 

[Tooljunkie]

if entire system is polluted with water, its going to be a task regardless what fluid you use.
Wolfman is correct, but what damage is the water doing? Add water to an automotive transmission and it is destroyed in short order.

Drain ,refill and replace filters. Work it and let sit for a week, pull plug and drain water that has settled out.top off and repeat. Work and let settle.

 

[steveInMaryland]

All,

I can tell you this, it now has cheap walmart (wm) oil in it and it is much happier. I'm sure it will be even happier when super udt2 goes back in. In the mean time I have 20 gallons of wm on order and I will change it out over the next several months.

I have 4 trans filters on order to try and filter out the debris from killing the bio in it. I had this problem in my younger years with a Honda XR dirt bike. I took adding a biocide in the gas to finally stop me from cleaning the carb once a week. F the humid east coast of the US. Never happened in Colorado.

Anyway, the bottom line question is; do you, my knowledge base, think a diesel bio killer will work in hydraulic fluid? And second a more general question; do you think a 12 volt vacuum pump pulling from the vent of the transmission will help?

Semper Fi (Always faithful)

 

[steveInMaryland]

I apparently didn't read all the posts thoroughly. So vacuum is a bad thing. I'll scrap that idea. Fluid and filters are a good thing, got that, some kero to make it all flow out, got that. What about a biocide? Nothing on that yet.

One more general question; I raised the bucket and backhoe to their highest point, drained the transmission fluid and thought if I lowered them more fluid would come out, didn't happen, so when a hydraulic valve controlling a (what ever) goes from up to down, does the valve send the oil from the up circuit to the down circuit and not to the return it the reservoir, in this case the tranny?

That is the longest run on sentence I have ever written. Sorry.

 

[Bulldog]

Adding fuel treatment to the tranny is a bad idea. You may have missed it but the kero is also a bad idea.

Like Wolfman said you're dealing with a expensive transmission. The cheap Walmart fluid isn't going to help you clutches either. I would use it a very short while and get that junk out. It's going to be bad to go thru all this and end up having to rebuild the tranny because of cheap fluid.

 

[steveInMaryland]

Bulldog,

This response is a little personal but I haven't been down your way since I was in Pensacola Fl for training in the mid 1980's. Love that area.

You have quiet the machine looking at your profile pic. I would love to own that machine.

Anyway, your 4k+ responses in this forum are always informed and have an air of been there and done that. Do you think draining and replacing the fluid 2-3 times (with filters) will fix this problem?

Semper fi,

 

[Grouse Feathers]

I apparently didn't read all the posts thoroughly. So vacuum is a bad thing. I'll scrap that idea. Fluid and filters are a good thing, got that, some kero to make it all flow out, got that. What about a biocide? Nothing on that yet.

We used to get biological growth in the lube oil for the generating units in a power plant, usually during an extended outage. Depending on how fast we had to kill the bugs and clean up the system, we either used a biocide or heat. I believe a temperature of 160 F kills the bugs and we used to heat the oil reservoirs to 180 to ensure success. I think an HST would get that hot, but I don't know about a GST. I think you would want to keep it hot for at least 2 hours to soak the heat throughout the system.

 

[Tooljunkie]

So heat will cook out moisture also, 180 is like operating temp, maybe on the hot side. Couple magnetic heaters may work.

In regards to the hydraulic cylinders, remove them and drain oil out would be the most effective. One side of cylinder has more volume than the other, extended has larger volume.

Just they will take a while to evacuate air.

Albeit WM oil is cheap, if it is compatable with your machine i cant see it doing any harm in the short time you will be using it. Two changes would be good, four will be better.
Interesting thing this algae thing, i havent seen anything like this up here in these parts.

 

[MagKarl]

How many folks here have destroyed tractor clutches and transmissions because of using Walmart fluid? I've heard of folks with HST claiming better performance with more expensive fluid, but I don't remember hearing of damage with cheaper fluids.

 

[Bulldog]

For those in doubt, scroll back up to Wolfman's last comment on cheap fluid in a GST tranny.

Steve, yes I believe draining it several times is about the only way to go. After you change the fluid it needs to be used and get it hot. All the functions need to be used so the fresh oil can be cycled thru. If nothing else find you a spot and dig a hole, refill and dig again. It needs to be worked hard to build enough heat to make a difference. Keep us posted on how it goes.

 

[steveInMaryland]

I don't have any real progress on this issue except there is definitely an o-ring protecting the fluid now.

On a much lighter note, I picked up my top and tilt today for it; I am super excited to play with it. Factory, NIB, old stock from a dealer that sold his business and had some things stuck in his shed. Very nice gentleman. Spent an hour just shooting BS.

Unfortunately I will not play with that as I need run the backhoe and bucket hard and heat up the tranny fluid to try and walk away from this water/bacteria problem.

I must say I am a little shocked none of you have not run into the bacteria.

Anyway, on it, will get this under control and will post how I did it.

Semper Fi,
Steve

 

[Grouse Feathers]

I must say I am a little shocked none of you have not run into the bacteria.

Semper Fi,
Steve

Steve

As long as you can keep the water out there is no bacteria problem. If you use the tractor on a regular basis you should cook out any water and kill any bugs by just getting to normal operating temperature, especially for those with a hydrostatic transmission. One possible source of bugs would be some water hiding out in an cylinder for a long period and then hooking it into the hydraulics.