New Cars/Trucks

[BBFarmer]

This is the first I've heard of that fairy tail. What kind of data is that statement based on? I've owned plenty of turbocharged vehicles, including an F150 with twin turbos, and not one has leaked oil.

25 years of consecutive employment as an automotive technician .......especially on 3.5 eco boost f150s LOL. I'm not knockin your rig brother. It is what it is.

I've posted quite a bit of escapades that take place at my licensed, llc'd, repair facility active since 09' including several cab off 3.5 repairs. Please do go check them out. I'm not the most experienced by any means, but I am truthful. Again, only been doing it every day for 25 years and I understand most i interact with on here are much more experienced. So no disrespect intended.

So I'm not knocking your rig. But I do WEEKLY major repairs sometimes pertaining specifically to ford 3.5s. You obviously have a good one and I am honestly happy for you on that. I don't wish expensive auto repairs on anybody.

I would say the oil leaks related to turbo engines comment would pertain more towards gasoline engines. Definitely can't comment on a good ole kubota turbo diesel. And this would mainly be caused by excess unwanted crankcase pressure.

 

[lugbolt]

a mechanic that is worth anything has a reputation

for instance I do a lot of polaris stuff, many Rangers

it would be easy to say that all I see every day, 5 days a week, is broken rangers and that would be truthful. However lets look at the real story here. I might see 5 or 6 a day. out of those, 2 or 3 are oil changes, 1 might need a belt or clutch. The other one may need a bushing or to fix a rat chewed wire. So it's not all gloom and doom, but because I see them daily I could aways say "they spend a lot of time in the shop". The other side of this is that the dealer sold 400 and some Rangers last year, and 500+ the year before, so if 10% of them show up at the shop, that's 40-50 of them. OMG they should NOT be in the shop, certainly not that many. But they do, and it pays my bills for which I am thankful for. Kubota paid my bills for a LONG time the same way. I saw orange stuff daily 6 sometimes 7 days a week for 29 1/2 years so it'd be easy to say that they spend a lot of time in the shop too.

On the 3.5's I know some owners who have 240-250,000 miles on them without major issues. And I know guys who have had issues at 20,000. And I know at least one owner who don't know how to maintain anything, his has 64,000 on it-and probably on the original oil and filter and air filter. Maintenance is not in his vocabulary, never has been. He's looking for a new truck as we speak. No problem that I know of, but that is one truck that I would NOT want to buy!

turbo engines do need slightly different maintanence but most people won't do it any differently. Also when you start the engine let it warm up a little, and when you get to your destination, let it idle a while before you cut it off. This helps. Minimum 1 minute with no load on it. Most won't do it, and I catch myself "forgetting" too.

but just because it's turbocharged doesn't in itself make it less reliable! If that were the case every single big truck out there and almost every diesel engine out there would be considered unreliable too and that is not the case. THe greatest challenge with the gas turbo engines is fuel system and air intake. Run good fuel (and quit depending on the knock sensor by using 87 gas), keep the air filter clean, and keep the engine oil clean, it'll last a LONG time. But everyone wants to run 10,000 mi oil changes and nobody checks air filters anymore so what do you expect? Same things I see on Polaris, lack of proper maintenance. It kills them but nothing I can say or do changes anyone's mind when they're stubborn.

 

[BAP]

Update the thread - - - just a little update.

We actually stopped at a dealership we were driving by to kick tires.

Place was closed. Didn't talk to a salesperson.

Had a couple 2026 Equinox 1LT AWD 1.5l turbos. Just like hers.

Sticker is not much different than 8 years ago.

Per the internet, have some "deals" on trucks. Mostly half-tons, as usual.

This place has Chevy and GMC trucks.

Prices on trucks are all over...... a 1500 LTZ was $70k. A lot of options and not much truck for the money.

Not a fan of the "Turbomax" 2.7L I-4 in the trucks. I know the 5.3L has/had issues. I-4 has been around a while, but I can't warm up to it.

A Chevy 2500HD 4x4 WT with 6.6L and Allison transmission caught my interest. Like the 6.0L, fuel mileage isn't good, but I don't drive a lot. Has locking rear differential (important to me), 8 foot box and extended cab (not crew cab).

Priced similar to my current truck, but probably no incentives. I think I caught a big rebate on this truck.

Unless the truck is actually what you want and there is a great deal on that particular truck, I would figure out what you want a new truck to be configured like and search for it. You can do a lot of searching yourself and the dealer can do more. Don’t settle for a truck that is kind of what you want at these prices.

 

[BBFarmer]

a mechanic that is worth anything has a reputation

for instance I do a lot of polaris stuff, many Rangers

it would be easy to say that all I see every day, 5 days a week, is broken rangers and that would be truthful. However lets look at the real story here. I might see 5 or 6 a day. out of those, 2 or 3 are oil changes, 1 might need a belt or clutch. The other one may need a bushing or to fix a rat chewed wire. So it's not all gloom and doom, but because I see them daily I could aways say "they spend a lot of time in the shop". The other side of this is that the dealer sold 400 and some Rangers last year, and 500+ the year before, so if 10% of them show up at the shop, that's 40-50 of them. OMG they should NOT be in the shop, certainly not that many. But they do, and it pays my bills for which I am thankful for. Kubota paid my bills for a LONG time the same way. I saw orange stuff daily 6 sometimes 7 days a week for 29 1/2 years so it'd be easy to say that they spend a lot of time in the shop too.

On the 3.5's I know some owners who have 240-250,000 miles on them without major issues. And I know guys who have had issues at 20,000. And I know at least one owner who don't know how to maintain anything, his has 64,000 on it-and probably on the original oil and filter and air filter. Maintenance is not in his vocabulary, never has been. He's looking for a new truck as we speak. No problem that I know of, but that is one truck that I would NOT want to buy!

turbo engines do need slightly different maintanence but most people won't do it any differently. Also when you start the engine let it warm up a little, and when you get to your destination, let it idle a while before you cut it off. This helps. Minimum 1 minute with no load on it. Most won't do it, and I catch myself "forgetting" too.

but just because it's turbocharged doesn't in itself make it less reliable! If that were the case every single big truck out there and almost every diesel engine out there would be considered unreliable too and that is not the case. THe greatest challenge with the gas turbo engines is fuel system and air intake. Run good fuel (and quit depending on the knock sensor by using 87 gas), keep the air filter clean, and keep the engine oil clean, it'll last a LONG time. But everyone wants to run 10,000 mi oil changes and nobody checks air filters anymore so what do you expect? Same things I see on Polaris, lack of proper maintenance. It kills them but nothing I can say or do changes anyone's mind when they're stubborn.

Well put sir.

I believe lack of maintenance has everything to do with it as well. 10k mile service intervals for gas burners are generally not the best thing for the majority of the population.

 

[lugbolt]

don't discount the little baby turbo 4 pot. Go drive one, I think you may be surprised. It has more torque down low than the 5.3 does. Few guys out here pull their boats to/from the lake with them and they are impressed. I have not driven one.

same people dissed the little 4 cylinder mustangs and frankly so did i. In 19 I found one local (used) and the price was right so I drove it, figuring I wasn't ever gonna own it. 2 hours later I drove it home. Great car, and a ton of power for what it is. Great MPG too. Paid $20k for it (cash), with 24,000 mi. This was before covid really hit and I was working on a 93 mustang coupe with a 2.3 (SVO turbo 2.3) and already had a 92 Mustang with a 600hp 427. The coupe got done a year or so after I bought the ecoboost, and I really didn't need the ecoboost anymore. Guy I work for owns a car dealer (several actually) and he overheard me telling one of my coworkers that I may sell it. Said when youy're ready holler, I'll make you an offer on it. Few days later I told him figure it up, what it's worth. They offered me $28,000 for it, exactly a year after I bought it and it had almost 50,000 mi on it by then. It'd have been foolish NOT to sell it to them. Then in 22 I sold the 93 which was a FUN car, stupid mistake but it needed to go away. Ordered the 22 EB and it came in 7 months later; and I still have it. Routinely sees 40 mpg sometimes closer to 50 if I drive it right but usually averages mid 30's and still makes 315hp. So ecoboost does in fact do what they say it will. It's not a GT, never will be but I like it. Easy to service haven't had any issues out of anything, currently 35,000 miles and time for service again which I will do later this week (shop is FULL). I don't drive as much as I used to either. But I've been impressed with them and the 3.5's both (in the f150's). For 2 that have problems 25 don't, deal is people that have problems are much more vocal than people that don't and that's why you see "problems" all over the net. May also look at the 2.7 ecoboost which has been mostly problem free and still plenty of power for most people.

 

[BBFarmer]

don't discount the little baby turbo 4 pot. Go drive one, I think you may be surprised. It has more torque down low than the 5.3 does. Few guys out here pull their boats to/from the lake with them and they are impressed. I have not driven one.

same people dissed the little 4 cylinder mustangs and frankly so did i. In 19 I found one local (used) and the price was right so I drove it, figuring I wasn't ever gonna own it. 2 hours later I drove it home. Great car, and a ton of power for what it is. Great MPG too. Paid $20k for it (cash), with 24,000 mi. This was before covid really hit and I was working on a 93 mustang coupe with a 2.3 (SVO turbo 2.3) and already had a 92 Mustang with a 600hp 427. The coupe got done a year or so after I bought the ecoboost, and I really didn't need the ecoboost anymore. Guy I work for owns a car dealer (several actually) and he overheard me telling one of my coworkers that I may sell it. Said when youy're ready holler, I'll make you an offer on it. Few days later I told him figure it up, what it's worth. They offered me $28,000 for it, exactly a year after I bought it and it had almost 50,000 mi on it by then. It'd have been foolish NOT to sell it to them. Then in 22 I sold the 93 which was a FUN car, stupid mistake but it needed to go away. Ordered the 22 EB and it came in 7 months later; and I still have it. Routinely sees 40 mpg sometimes closer to 50 if I drive it right but usually averages mid 30's and still makes 315hp. So ecoboost does in fact do what they say it will. It's not a GT, never will be but I like it. Easy to service haven't had any issues out of anything, currently 35,000 miles and time for service again which I will do later this week (shop is FULL). I don't drive as much as I used to either. But I've been impressed with them and the 3.5's both (in the f150's). For 2 that have problems 25 don't, deal is people that have problems are much more vocal than people that don't and that's why you see "problems" all over the net. May also look at the 2.7 ecoboost which has been mostly problem free and still plenty of power for most people.

Yea, i'd say you definitely did more than alright on that deal LOL. Too bad they can't all go like that.

I've done 2 2.3 ecoboost timing jobs in several years versus possibly an easy 20ish 3.5 jobs just THIS year. Couldn't tell you how many over a 5 or 10 year span. Had to buy a seperate timing kit for the 2.3 that had a rear style hold down for the camshaft because I couldn't adapt any one of my 3 ford timing/3.5 service kits. Go figure.

No, I bet the little babymax is ok. You just got to be careful sometimes if you're the test bunny on some of these 1st gen creations. You're a tech so you know what I mean. You see them end up revising major faults quickly leaving some folks wishing they'd held out for the problem free gen 2.

Now that 2.7 you mention surprised alot of folks. When we first started seeing 3.5s and 2.7s we just knew the 2.7 was gonna be junk......ain't torn into a single one yet LOL! Most of us just heard 2.7 though and were still gun shy from the dreaded old Chrysler 2.7.

And I aint knocking the 3.5 either. It is a good setup. Half the timing jobs I do are the standard cam phaser rattle alot of the early setups were prone to. The other half are due to lack of maintenance, sludged up phasers, vvt solenoid screens, chain tensioners, etc....

They'll typically develop a quick oil leak off the back of the bank 1 (passenger) head caused by a failed seal at the vacuum pump, no biggie, quick fix. Shortly later in life it will be your standard run of the mill valve cover leak, again nothing major. However, because younger techs and most DIY'ers don't figure out to punch the spark plug tube seals through, they crack the composite valve covers trying like hell to break them free from the heads. It was bad enough they went on national back order for quite some time. We always keep a pair in stock. Standard rear main seal leaks will show up, just like on anything else, but we tend to see them more on the 5.0s than 3.5s. Coolant leaks on earlier models like 15' or 14's down, would be a bad run of quick connect fittings they were using on the turbos. And eventually they updated that.

Normal stuff that happens on tons of other vehicles. Keeps all that dang food I be makin on the table!

 

[WFM]

Im liking this thread. My last three F150s have all been 5.0's , 400hp.
I'd never buy a Eco as in my mind of course the turbo is gonna puke out.
As far as the start stop. My girlfriend has a '21 forester she bought new. That thing will need a new battery by fall as it barely wants to restart once it shuts off. A POS idea the start stop.

 

[BBFarmer]

I'd never buy a Eco as in my mind of course the turbo is gonna puke out.

Turbos never go out LOL

Boxing up yesterdays core from a 6.7 powerstroke I did yesterday.. And this actually was a warranty I had just installed from jasper a few months ago.
April yesterdays

I actually have never had any turbo failures on the 3.5. Several 2.0s in the edges.

The 3.5s turbos will develop wastegate spring rattles in time. Never had any customers want to do anything about it yet though.

 

[WFM]

That 6.7 is my dream engine. I've talked to many customers of mine that own them. My favorite story is a Vermont customer that went from the Duramax to the F350 with the 6.7 turbo diesel to haul his fifth wheel. He told me "It just has to much power"...that is the engine I want in my F150 I thought. I've never needed to haul that much. So never ever went for the superduty. But I can dream.

 

[The Evil Twin]

Unless the truck is actually what you want and there is a great deal on that particular truck, I would figure out what you want a new truck to be configured like and search for it. You can do a lot of searching yourself and the dealer can do more. Don’t settle for a truck that is kind of what you want at these prices.

My favorite search engine is visor.vin
Check it out. The free version is still incredibly useful

 

[The Evil Twin]

Im liking this thread. My last three F150s have all been 5.0's , 400hp.
I'd never buy a Eco as in my mind of course the turbo is gonna puke out.
As far as the start stop. My girlfriend has a '21 forester she bought new. That thing will need a new battery by fall as it barely wants to restart once it shuts off. A POS idea the start stop.

There is a widget you can plug into the OBD port to defeat the S/S and keep it off

 

[lugbolt]

The turbo doesn't generally fail unless there is an outside cause. Lack of maintenance, dirt ingestion, foreign object ingestion, lack of a cooldown after a long hot run, and/or overspeeding.

coking the bearing housing is a big cause and is preventable. When you stop at your destination let the thing idle for a minute or so before shutdown. "Coking" is when the turbo is about 1500 degrees after a run, and then it's shut down still "that" hot. The oil cooks in the bearing housing and turns to a hardened version of oil, which most turbo guys call "coke". Plugs things up, coats the hydrodynamic bearings, the housing, thrust bearing, etc-and lack of lube follows. It doesn't generally happen one time but rather over a longer period of time of hot shutdowns so most guys will say "the turbo failed at 80,000 mi (or however long) it's junk" when the root cause could very well have been improper shutdown. The bigger the turbo the more likely this is to happen as the bigger units hold (and retain) more oil. Gas burners are more likely too because most gas vehicle owners have no idea, they get to their destination after coming off of the freeway at mach jesus and shut it off to go inside.

The 5.0's haven't been bulletproof either.

 

[The Evil Twin]

The turbo doesn't generally fail unless there is an outside cause. Lack of maintenance, dirt ingestion, foreign object ingestion, lack of a cooldown after a long hot run, and/or overspeeding.

coking the bearing housing is a big cause and is preventable. When you stop at your destination let the thing idle for a minute or so before shutdown. "Coking" is when the turbo is about 1500 degrees after a run, and then it's shut down still "that" hot. The oil cooks in the bearing housing and turns to a hardened version of oil, which most turbo guys call "coke". Plugs things up, coats the hydrodynamic bearings, the housing, thrust bearing, etc-and lack of lube follows. It doesn't generally happen one time but rather over a longer period of time of hot shutdowns so most guys will say "the turbo failed at 80,000 mi (or however long) it's junk" when the root cause could very well have been improper shutdown. The bigger the turbo the more likely this is to happen as the bigger units hold (and retain) more oil. Gas burners are more likely too because most gas vehicle owners have no idea, they get to their destination after coming off of the freeway at mach jesus and shut it off to go inside.

The 5.0's haven't been bulletproof either.

That's why I don't shut the engine off when fueling up.

 

[KubotaHawg]

Buy an older Tundra (5.7L, pre twin turbo engines), do the maintenance yourself, and drive it until the wheels fall off--if they ever do. Best service advisor I ever dealt with (on my 2012, with 170k miles) looked around to make sure no one was listening and said "don't ever get rid of that truck--the engines are bullet proof if you maintain them like you do. They don't like me to tell people that."

Second son drives that one now, first son put 50k miles on it. I currently drive a 2017 that just passed 100,00 miles and it will be my last vehicle God willing.

Wife drives a 2005 Wrangler with 65k miles. Old technology, easy to maintain, no turbos or computers--and the payments on all three are really great. Never thought I would say it but I guess I understand now what my dad meant when he said "the older they are the better they were."

 

[BBFarmer]

Buy an older Tundra (5.7L, pre twin turbo engines), do the maintenance yourself, and drive it until the wheels fall off--if they ever do. Best service advisor I ever dealt with (on my 2012, with 170k miles) looked around to make sure no one was listening and said "don't ever get rid of that truck--the engines are bullet proof if you maintain them like you do. They don't like me to tell people that."

Second son drives that one now, first son put 50k miles on it. I currently drive a 2017 that just passed 100,00 miles and it will be my last vehicle God willing.

Wife drives a 2005 Wrangler with 65k miles. Old technology, easy to maintain, no turbos or computers--and the payments on all three are really great. Never thought I would say it but I guess I understand now what my dad meant when he said "the older they are the better they were."

I'll agree with that. The ONLY thing I EVER see older tundras/sequoias for are secondary air injection faults.

Very solid setup.

 

[Botamon]

I'd never buy a Eco as in my mind of course the turbo is gonna puke out.

Funny how people get a perception that a turbo on a gas engine is somehow less reliable than a turbo on a diesel engine. Guy here in town made that same kind of statement when we were discussing the 5.0 Coyote versus an Ecoboost. He owns a business and runs 5 turbodiesel trucks and got all vaporlocked when I asked how many times he'd had to change a turbo on any of his diesels, because the answer was zero.

 

[William1]

These days, first owners, 30K lease, they do not maintain it at all. Turn it in, get a new. That turn in becomes sold as a used car. An unmaintained used car. Even if, the new owner finally changes the oil, damage is done, sludge accumulated.

 

[WFM]

My only issue with the ecoboost engine is something to go wrong that a natural aspirated engine doesn't have. If my pockets were deeper id own the 6.7 turbo diesel. I have no issues owning that turbo.

 

[BBFarmer]

Funny how people get a perception that a turbo on a gas engine is somehow less reliable than a turbo on a diesel engine. Guy here in town made that same kind of statement when we were discussing the 5.0 Coyote versus an Ecoboost. He owns a business and runs 5 turbodiesel trucks and got all vaporlocked when I asked how many times he'd had to change a turbo on any of his diesels, because the answer was zero.

I don't think anybody has stated they are less reliable.

Its obvious you never have experienced turbo/turbo related problems at your shop. My shop on the other hand has and does.

I've stated and given examples of these issues that I OFTEN encounter on these engines. And its only based on 25 years of continuous professional experience and employment in the field.

Its probably just the way I read into it, But your comments seem fairly condescending.

Like I'm over here pretending to be a tech, tellin stories, and postin fake photos LOL. I'm just telling y'all what I see on all this junk over time brother!

And once again, I'm happy your buddy doesn't have problems with his 5 diesels. I will say the one I posted yesterday is a fleet truck for a paving company. It pulls a small dozer and a paver. Shes deleted and not on a stock tune.

 

[RCW]

This continues to be a great discussion.

Much appreciated.

I might still look at both a truck and an Equinox as a package deal while some of their incentives are going.

Equinox AWD LT is probably the more important replacement and will likely look to replace her car in-kind. She's been happy with it.

Been a good car (knocking on wood) as @BBFarmer said a while back. That's a 1.5l I-4 turbo. First turbo I've had.

Trucks are just so difficult - - - I see BIG $$ GMC 1500 with the 3.0 diesels. Same with other Chevies with the 2.7L I-4 gas. Lot of options for not that much truck. Not a fan of the engines. Have many incentives on 1500 trucks right now.

Still get back to that 2500 Work Truck......has all I need and is a time-proven engine and transmission (although 6.6l replaced the 6.0 years ago). No incentives, which is a tough nut.