BX 1850 steering

[netxtown]

I did some ranting and raving a couple years back about this orange thing in my yard. The plastic body has all but completely fallen off. I got over it. The engine and tranny are still smooth - starts every time and no problems. But the one thing that has not found any lasting resolution is the danged steering.

I finally took it down to a dealer. I told them about the steering cylinder info that others had encountered. Their diagnosis lead to the replacement of the steering pump. A week later I was left wandering. Took it back and all they would tell me is 'we made it right'. And again, within a couple weeks I was left wandering except with hard yank left and hard yank right.

And now - the really weird part. I can lift the front wheels just barely off the ground and the wheels turn full left and full right all the way to the respective stops. I can pull really hard on the steering wheel - but the steering wheel will not freely turn (like it does in normal operation) at the stops.

I am at wits end with it. The $1400 pump fiasco has left me feeling like it was all a crap shoot. I just want the danged steering to move the front wheels normally.

I'm wide open for any hints, tips, tricks, ideas, or thoughts.

 

[lugbolt]

Was the steering cylinder replaced yet? If not, it should have been.

 

[netxtown]

I am 'assuming' it was. BUT - I have no proof of that - so my gut tells me they probably did a quick rebuild and left it at that.

OTOH - if it was replaced, I sure don't want to spend another $2-300 to replace it again...and it not be THE fix...again.

I guess it's obvious I don't know which way to jump anymore.

 

[armylifer]

In my opinion; if the pump was honestly replaced and the pump has been verified as working, at the proper pressure, then it has to be the steering cylinder. If it were mine, I would ask the dealer to list all the work that was performed in detail. If the steering cylinder was just rebuilt and not replaced, then I would suspect a faulty rebuild on the steering cylinder. Other than that, check your Hydraulic fluid level and be sure that it is full to the line.

 

[whitetiger]

On a BX tractor, if the steering wonders and you have to jerk the wheel to turn it, your problem was not the steering control valve but is the steering cylinder its self. It is a very common failure on all BX models, your dealer should know about it by now. The cylinder can be rebuilt, but many have an out-of-round barrel. The replacement cylinder is greatly improved and I personally have not seen any of them fail.

The BX tractor does not have a separate steering pump, it uses the same pump with a priority valve to supply all hydraulic functions.

 

[armylifer]

On a BX tractor, if the steering wonders and you have to jerk the wheel to turn it, your problem was not the steering control valve but is the steering cylinder its self. It is a very common failure on all BX models, your dealer should know about it by now. The cylinder can be rebuilt, but many have an out-of-round barrel. The replacement cylinder is greatly improved and I personally have not seen any of them fail.

The BX tractor does not have a separate steering pump, it uses the same pump with a priority valve to supply all hydraulic functions.

Do you happen to know when the redesigned steering cylinder was put on tractors? I have never had a problem with mine but I have read some posts where people had the symptom of a faulty steering cylinder, the the OP describes. BTW, I was assuming that he meant the steering control valve since there is no external "pump".

 

[whitetiger]

Do you happen to know when the redesigned steering cylinder was put on tractors? I have never had a problem with mine but I have read some posts where people had the symptom of a faulty steering cylinder, the OP describes. BTW, I was assuming that he meant the steering control valve since there is no external "pump".

I am thinking they started being used on the 70series, but that is just a guess at best.
I also assumed he was referring to the steering control valve rather than the externally mounted hydraulic pump.

 

[netxtown]

While i was told the "steering hand pump" was the part replaced, it was actually the Steering Unit (K2561-41510). It was a pretty expensive piece.

When i took it back after it started wandering again - I wasn't given any docs as to what was done this second time around. Only the verbiage "I told you we would make it right". Based on that - I'm doubting very much the cylinder was replaced. Just a rebuild (cheaper option).

Still - what I just don't get is that the steering works perfectly when the front wheels are not touching the ground.

 

[North Idaho Wolfman]

While i was told the "steering hand pump" was the part replaced, it was actually the Steering Unit (K2561-41510). It was a pretty expensive piece.

When i took it back after it started wandering again - I wasn't given any docs as to what was done this second time around. Only the verbiage "I told you we would make it right". Based on that - I'm doubting very much the cylinder was replaced. Just a rebuild (cheaper option).

Still - what I just don't get is that the steering works perfectly when the front wheels are not touching the ground.

You will now have had three Tech's tell you, It needs a new steering cylinder.

That dealer isn't very educated, as just about every tech knows when a tractor acts the way yours does it needs a new cylinder.

The reason it works perfectly when the front wheels are off the ground, is there is little to no resistance on the steering cylinder, so the fluid just goes where it's supposed to without bypassing the internal seal.

 

[eserv]

You will now have had three Tech's tell you, It needs a new steering cylinder.

That dealer isn't very educated, as just about every tech knows when a tractor acts the way yours does it needs a new cylinder.

The reason it works perfectly when the front wheels are off the ground, is there is little to no resistance on the steering cylinder, so the fluid just goes where it's supposed to without bypassing the internal seal.

Classic symptoms of a failed steering cylinder!

 

[netxtown]

Ok...Steering Cylinder replacement it is!

I will report back after i replace it.

FWIW - I am replacing a very large deck and have 35 holes to auger. Yesterday i tried backing up to the very first hole - and i couldn't even get this orange thing to give me enough steering control to get centered on the "X". grrrrr

 

[lugbolt]

If the steering cylinder was just rebuilt and not replaced, then I would suspect a faulty rebuild on the steering cylinder.

Maybe not necessarily a "faulty rebuild"--perhaps faulty parts, as in a cylinder barrel bore that is not within spec, or a piston assembly that is not within spec, bent ram (even slightly), etc. Rebuilding a cylinder is easy. Checking it....takes time. For what a BX steering cylinder costs, and what labor charges are nowadays, it don't make no sense to rebuild it (properly), as it's about the same cost-maybe a little more-than just replacing it with the newer part number. The original supercedes to a different number as I recall. What's the "new" one? Dunno. Maybe a different color. They never tell us what the difference is.

Hydrostatic steering rarely fails, or at least the controllers rarely fail. Usually the cylinder yet for some reason a lot of folks (including techs) automatically and sometimes incorrectly assume that when the hydrostatic steering "acts up", it's the controller. Maybe it's human nature. There isn't a cut-and-dried test for them anyway, which doesn't help much. That's where experience comes in and experience isn't the young guy that makes minimum wage. But that min wage tech WILL learn one way or another, if he can take the heat from "learning".

 

[netxtown]

My apologies for letting this languish for so long. A little stay in the hospital followed by a round of cancer kind of derailed me for awhile.

I finally bit the bullet and just replaced the cylinder myself. The hardest part was finding one to buy. These cylinders are in high demand, short supply - and so the prices have been adjusted accordingly! OUCH!!

In any case, I replaced the cylinder and the tie rod ends/balljoints.......and.....(drum roll, please)....it works! I now have real steering! Yippee!

I did send an email to that Kubota dealership. I didn't hold back. I doubt they will be waiting for a return visit.

 

[armylifer]

I am glad that you finally got it working. Take care!