Intermittent shut-off

[Shawn T. W]

Back in the spring I was mowing in the rain with my L5030, it would shut off like I turned the key off, no sputtering like running out of fuel, it did it 3-4 times, one time it would just crank but no start, after sitting for a few minutes it would start. the other times it would fire right back up like there wasn't a problem ... My guess was the fuel shut off solenoid was the culprit, but why would it run for hours later with no problems?

It's done it a couple of times since ... But no rain.

Today I was out mowing, it shut off four times in about an hour, and it was dry out, one of those times it would just crank, but not fire ...

I got it up to the house and decided to change the fuel filter, as I had never changed it, and I had put 98 hours on since I got it last summer ... It was hard to really tell the condition, the sticker was kinda in the way ...



I pulled it out, and the filter looked fine ...



There was some sediment in the bottom of the bowl, but no water.





I cleaned it all up, and put a new filter in it ...



I didn't bother to "bleed" it, as my Massey Ferguson says too, but it starts no problem without ... I got about 10' and it sputtered and died like it had run out of fuel ... I couldn't find what I would have thought was the bleed screw, got the manual and noticed the valve handle was missing!



Got a pair of pliers and turned it a quarter turn counter clockwise like the manual said, it didn't have a stop in either direction, not sure if it's supposed to, got it running!

Went back to mowing, the next 3 hours were uneventful! I'm fairly certain the fuel filter had nothing to do with it, and am considering just buying a fuel shut off solenoid ... What do you think?

 

[North Idaho Wolfman]

Back in the spring I was mowing in the rain with my L5030, it would shut off like I turned the key off, no sputtering like running out of fuel, it did it 3-4 times, one time it would just crank but no start, after sitting for a few minutes it would start. the other times it would fire right back up like there wasn't a problem ... My guess was the fuel shut off solenoid was the culprit, but why would it run for hours later with no problems?

It's done it a couple of times since ... But no rain.

Today I was out mowing, it shut off four times in about an hour, and it was dry out, one of those times it would just crank, but not fire ...

I got it up to the house and decided to change the fuel filter, as I had never changed it, and I had put 98 hours on since I got it last summer ... It was hard to really tell the condition, the sticker was kinda in the way ...

View attachment 181550

I pulled it out, and the filter looked fine ...

View attachment 181551

There was some sediment in the bottom of the bowl, but no water.

View attachment 181552

View attachment 181553

I cleaned it all up, and put a new filter in it ...

View attachment 181554

I didn't bother to "bleed" it, as my Massey Ferguson says too, but it starts no problem without ... I got about 10' and it sputtered and died like it had run out of fuel ... I couldn't find what I would have thought was the bleed screw, got the manual and noticed the valve handle was missing!

View attachment 181555

Got a pair of pliers and turned it a quarter turn counter clockwise like the manual said, it didn't have a stop in either direction, not sure if it's supposed to, got it running!

Went back to mowing, the next 3 hours were uneventful! I'm fairly certain the fuel filter had nothing to do with it, and am considering just buying a fuel shut off solenoid ... What do you think?

Solenoid, relay, safety switch, or wiring.

 

[D2Cat]

Had a similar problem on my Deutz. Ended up being a glob of grass in the fuel tank. The tank has a cap that covers a hole about 4" in dia. and over time the grass got in there. I would declare it wasn't me, but who knows?

 

[Shawn T. W]

One thing I forgot to mention was that I have the seat switch bypassed ...

The crank but not fire situation seems to me that it's not a safety switch that would have it shut off.

 

[North Idaho Wolfman]

One thing I forgot to mention was that I have the seat switch bypassed ...

The crank but not fire situation seems to me that it's not a safety switch that would have it shut off.

So your down to solenoid, relay, OPC (if equipped), and wiring.
Do you have the WSM for it?

 

[Shawn T. W]

So your down to solenoid, relay, OPC (if equipped), and wiring.
Do you have the WSM for it?

What is the "OPC"?

Could the ignition switch also be a culprit if it cranks but won't start? Or possibly just the wiring from the switch?

Yes, I have the WSM.

 

[Shawn T. W]

Looking at the WSM ... To my eyes, and using a camera, the wiring colors are still confusing ... There seems to maybe be a number besides letter(s)?



The whole thing for my Cabbed ("Cabin") wiring diagram ...



Once I get down to the wire color it's seems fuzzy to me ...





So ... I bundled up and went out to the barn and took some pictures of what I believe are the shut-off solenoid and relay ...

Looks like black/red & black green on the solenoid



But here it looks black/blue like the diagram "might" be indicating? (Near the top, but center behind that slashed pipe)



On the relay there are only three wires, so I'm guessing that there is no "OPC" (whatever that is?)

Here it shows a red/white that I can't even with guessing is on the diagram ... Am I looking at the right part?



I don't see any evidence of chewing, apparently my cats are still keeping up, even after my best hunter was killed this past May by a coyote ... Ironically when I came in to get the filter I saw a little brown fuzzy critter run across my laundry room floor, I cornered it, and when I grabbed it, it but me! I grabbed it again, turned out to be a vole that one of my cats apparently brought in through there kitty door!

I'm supposed to meet another truck at our terminal this morning to head back out on the road again ... I may not even start this tractor again until spring mowing season, but would like to figure out what is causing this ...

 

[MossyCorner]

My L5030HTC was doing the same and mine was the fuel cutoff solenoid. When it got hot it would shut the tractor off. I was too cheap to buy a new solenoid so I removed the plunger from the solenoid and added a manual fuel cutoff cable.

 

[North Idaho Wolfman]

This is where a digital copy smokes a paper copy.
OPC is Operator Presence Control, an "ocupancy computer" it reads inputs from switches and power to know when to shut the tractor off.
The # in front of color is wire size.

 

[Shawn T. W]

The # in front of color is wire size.

I'm only familiar with wire gauge sizes, these must be something else!

Yes, the digital copy you sent me a link to is MUCH clearer! Thank you!

Looks like I got some testing when I'm home ... I'm thinking if I can tie in a few different colored lights into a few circuits, so I can see them when operating ... Light goes out, that is the problem area ...

 

[Shawn T. W]

On the relay there are only three wires, so I'm guessing that there is no "OPC" (whatever that is?)

Here it shows a red/white that I can't even with guessing is on the diagram ... Am I looking at the right part?

This is what I was thinking was the relay, what is it? The 3 wires don't match up to the manual, it has black, green, and red/white ... Is the solenoid stop relay somewhere else?



It looks like the connector has an open spot for a fourth wire.

 

[Shawn T. W]

This is what I was thinking was the relay, what is it?

I found it! Tachometer.



I'm still not sure where the relay is, any pointers?

I did find this, but I don't recall seeing any error messages when it happened, but I'm not sure I looked, as I didn't know it had this capability.



And for reference in case I forget where I found it ...

 

[Russell King]

I'm only familiar with wire gauge sizes, these must be something else!

Yes, the digital copy you sent me a link to is MUCH clearer! Thank you!

Looks like I got some testing when I'm home ... I'm thinking if I can tie in a few different colored lights into a few circuits, so I can see them when operating ... Light goes out, that is the problem area ...

The numbers are the wire size in a metric version of what we refer to as wire gauge. Gauge is really a strange way to specify a stranded wire but that is what we normally do here in America.

 

[Shawn T. W]

The numbers are the wire size in a metric version of what we refer to as wire gauge. Gauge is really a strange way to specify a stranded wire but that is what we normally do here in America.

So is that mm? Or similar to our gauge size, smaller number bigger wire?

 

[Russell King]

So is that mm? Or similar to our gauge size, smaller number bigger wire?

It is the square millimeter area of the wire (total area of all strands). Search “wire size by square mm” for more information. There are charts that show AWG versus mm squared that will show the numbers on the wiring diagram and an equivalent AWG when they exist (1.5=16 gauge for example)

 

[North Idaho Wolfman]

The Purple is the Stop solenoid relay and the Orange is the OPC timer:
The WSM has the steps for testing both.

The glow plug relay (1) is the same as the stop relay.