Daily Chuckle

xrocketengineer

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Lifetime Member

Equipment
BX1880, FEL, Grapple, 36 in. Forks, 48in. MMM, Quick Spade, Ripper
Nov 14, 2020
886
867
93
Merritt Island, Florida
WARNING! BORING ENGINEERING TOPIC

I have seen a ray of hope that humanity might survive AI.

I have been running calculations on a spreadsheet to figure out if a "flap gate" which is the only means of providing drainage to our neighborhood can open by itself. I intend to discuss the issue with the county engineer.

The first issue was to calculate the difference in opening moment (torque) vs. closing moment with the same water level on both sides. Clue: There is nowhere in hell that it will open. That might be the reason why the County sometimes forces the flap open with a piece of wood. Other times we get flooded. Hmmmm....

The second issue is how many inches of water (head pressure) it takes to open by itself with no water downstream and what would be the ratio of maximum downstream inches of water to upstream inches of water that would allow the flap to open. That was more difficult.

Resized_Resized_20220928_174015.jpg


The first part took me a while to do with the few neurons left in my brain that still work but it came out alright. The second part not so much, the algebra blew up my brain. So, I did the next best thing. Calculate the opening moment for a specific upstream water level and then calculate by trial and error the downstream water level that would give the same or lower closing moment value.

Anyway, I thought maybe AI can solve the relationship between the upstream and downstream water levels into a single equation. So, I uploaded the spreadsheet to MS Copilot and the reply I got was; it thanked me for the uploading of the spreadsheet and it explained what the calculations meant and that they were correct. I asked then for a direct relationship/equation for determining downstream water level vs. upstream that would allow the flap to open. It understood the question and the reply was to use the trial and error method or use the "Seek" function in Excel to automate the trial and error test.

In other words, Copilot was not any smarter than me and it could not solve the equation, it just knew of one other built-in tool in Excel to expedite what I was doing anyway. I am still waiting for the County engineer to return my call.
 
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chim

Well-known member

Equipment
L4240HSTC with FEL, Ford 1210
Jan 19, 2013
3,053
2,572
113
Near Lancaster, PA, USA
WARNING! BORING ENGINEERING TOPIC

I have seen a ray of hope that humanity might survive AI.

I have been running calculations on a spreadsheet to figure out if a "flap gate" which is the only means of providing drainage to our neighborhood can open by itself. I intend to discuss the issue with the county engineer.

The first issue was to calculate the difference in opening moment (torque) vs. closing moment with the same water level on both sides. Clue: There is nowhere in hell that it will open. That might be the reason why the County sometimes forces the flap open with a piece of wood. Other times we get flooded. Hmmmm....

The second issue is how many inches of water (head pressure) it takes to open by itself with no water downstream and what would be the ratio of maximum downstream inches of water to upstream inches of water that would allow the flap to open. That was more difficult.

View attachment 170086

The first part took me a while to do with the few neurons left in my brain that still work but it came out alright. The second part not so much, the algebra blew up my brain. So, I did the next best thing. Calculate the opening moment for a specific upstream water level and then calculate by trial and error the downstream water level that would give the same or lower closing moment value.

Anyway, I thought maybe AI can solve the relationship between the upstream and downstream water levels into a single equation. So, I uploaded the spreadsheet to MS Copilot and the reply I got was; it thanked me for the uploading of the spreadsheet and it explained what the calculations meant and that they were correct. I asked then for a direct relationship/equation for determining downstream water level vs. upstream that would allow the flap to open. It understood the question and the reply was to use the trial and error method or use the "Seek" function in Excel to automate the trial and error test.

In other words, Copilot was not any smarter than me and it could not solve the equation, it just knew of one other built-in tool in Excel to expedite what I was doing anyway. I am still waiting for the County engineer to return my call.
Drainage must be a whole different thing in Florida. Here in PA it's pretty much all open pipes. Sometimes they have bars over the ends to keep kids and logs out:)
 

xrocketengineer

Well-known member
Lifetime Member

Equipment
BX1880, FEL, Grapple, 36 in. Forks, 48in. MMM, Quick Spade, Ripper
Nov 14, 2020
886
867
93
Merritt Island, Florida
Drainage must be a whole different thing in Florida. Here in PA it's pretty much all open pipes. Sometimes they have bars over the ends to keep kids and logs out:)
Here, it is so flat that water flows one way sometimes and the opposite way the next. Sometimes the land is higher than the water and sometimes it is the opposite. Here, the bars at the end are to keep the manatees from getting stuck inside.
Manatee Rescue
 

lynnmor

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B2601-1
May 3, 2021
1,735
1,535
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Red Lion
Drainage must be a whole different thing in Florida. Here in PA it's pretty much all open pipes. Sometimes they have bars over the ends to keep kids and logs out:)
We have a couple of them in Marietta to allow flow into the Susquehanna and prevent flow from the river.