BX23s rear differential replacement.

[Tuckntruck]

Continuing my absolutely horrible experience with my BX23s - at 400 hours, my differential failed. I was in a 4x4, moving a bucket of dry dirt. Dumped the dirt and shifted to two-wheel drive to go down my driveway to get more dirt from the pile. As soon as I pulled the lever out of 4WD, I lost all hydrostatic braking and mechanical brakes. The tractor took off rolling with no way to stop it. I couldn't shift it back into 4x4. dropped the bucket and steered into a bank to stop. Once I was stopped, I was able to get it into 4WD again, and can confirm the brakes and drive work - however, only the front wheels. jacked the tractor up and put it in drive - the wheels spin a little with no force because of the torsional shear of the oil between the differential and axles. If I hold both wheels, it doesn't bog the tractor. Given that the front drive works, the brakes work, and that there is no load transfer between the wheels, the best bet is that the Bevel gear assembly, gear shaft, or the differential shaft failed.

Obviously, I won't buy parts until I get into it, but wondering if anybody has had the transmission apart - and if it can be done while still in the tractor. I really don't want to take the entire back of the machine apart AGAIN.

Not going to lie, I regret buying this tractor. It's been down hard for failures that amount to shitty assembly multiple times now. By far the worst big purchase I've ever made. I'm pretty sure once I get this fixed, I'm selling it and walking away. I definitely got a Friday night or Monday morning tractor.

 

[TECH101]

Its unfortunate for sure, I work at a dealership and see all the headaches trust me

Your going to have pull off the rear end if you think the issue is internal

 

[GreensvilleJay]

yeesh I feel for you !
question. simple test...with the rear wheels up in the air, if you spin the left one CW, does the right one spin CCW ? found this in the 'parts finder' at Kubota.
My BX23S is 7 years old, 1500+ hrs and I've 'used/abused' it so real curious as to what 'broke'. Hopefully others can reply soon. I know the WSM is online, might shed light on HOW the power goes from tranny to rear end.

 

[Tuckntruck]

Yeah it’s either 80, 180 or “A”. The brakes also function through the transmission.
No- it doesn’t spin the other wheel backwards, both wheels are freewheel at this point. While jacked up if I press forward or reverse the wheels will start to spin slowly with no force, which for me points to “80” as the dif carrier is spinning the friction of the hydraulic fluid is causing the axels to spin as well.

 

[TheOldHokie]

Yeah it’s either 80, 180 or “A”. The brakes also function through the transmission.
No- it doesn’t spin the other wheel backwards, both wheels are freewheel at this point. While jacked up if I press forward or reverse the wheels will start to spin slowly with no force, which for me points to “80” as the dif carrier is spinning the friction of the hydraulic fluid is causing the axels to spin as well.

You will have to take it apart to find the failure. Number 60 is the complete differential @ $565. Not much more than I paid 20 years ago for a B7200.

At only 400 hours whats your warranty status?

Dan

 

[Tuckntruck]

You will have to take it apart to find the failure. Number 60 is the complete differential @ $565. Not much more than I paid 20 years ago for a B7200.

At only 400 hours whats your warranty status?

Dan

Unfortunately expired- 2017 purchase.

 

[GreensvilleJay]

hmm, looking at the picture....IF 090 ,some retainer pin ) fell out, then 080, the bevel gear axle would fall out, then the gears and yes both wheels spin any which way....
gets me wondering HOW is that 'retaining pin' secured in place.

guess you'll have to tear it apart to see what's actually happened.

 

[Tuckntruck]

hmm, looking at the picture....IF 090 ,some retainer pin ) fell out, then 080, the bevel gear axle would fall out, then the gears and yes both wheels spin any which way....
gets me wondering HOW is that 'retaining pin' secured in place.

guess you'll have to tear it apart to see what's actually happened.

To be honest, there were no abnormal noises or symptoms until I was rapidly rolling down hill with no ability to stop the tractor. I kind of think if I had dropped a gear or broke something large - that things would have locked up or damaged the case. I’m betting it’s either 80 or the “A” group shaft just snapped… gotta make space in the garage and tear this thing apart… again.

that being said- it’s worth a mention, If you break the Diffetential in this tractor - you lose all ability to stop. If you are on a hill, you will go down it. After my experience, 100% will always be in 4WD when on an incline. That it was pretty scary as going left meant going over a retaining wall and right was trees /rocks. Dropping the bucket didn’t do much.

 

[TheOldHokie]

To be honest, there were no abnormal noises or symptoms until I was rapidly rolling down hill with no ability to stop the tractor. I kind of think if I had dropped a gear or broke something large - that things would have locked up or damaged the case. I’m betting it’s either 80 or the “A” group shaft just snapped… gotta make space in the garage and tear this thing apart… again.

that being said- it’s worth a mention, If you break the Diffetential in this tractor - you lose all ability to stop. If you are on a hill, you will go down it. After my experience, 100% will always be in 4WD when on an incline. That it was pretty scary as going left meant going over a retaining wall and right was trees /rocks. Dropping the bucket didn’t do much.

Range selector slipping into neutral will provide the same excitement.

Dan

 

[MapleLeafFarmer]

Has anyone torn into the rear in the past?

My experience is often the local shade tree mechanics were just not up to the task and maybe left you with a poorly repaired tractor causing you an endless cycle of problems due to their incompetence?

 

[Tuckntruck]

Has anyone torn into the rear in the past?

My experience is often the local shade tree mechanics were just not up to the task and maybe left you with a poorly repaired tractor causing you an endless cycle of problems due to their incompetence?

The pump/transmission has never been apart, I bought the machine new and it’s got 400 hours on it now.
I’ve done the oil and filter servicing on it myself… but that’s not a hard job.

 

[Tuckntruck]

Range selector slipping into neutral will provide the same excitement.

Dan

Yeah I can see that. While probably not a huge issue most of the time, that seems like a significant engineering oversight. The brakes on these tractors are for the most part redundant or for parking when the units off. You shouldn’t lose all braking ability simply because of trans gearing. Even if rudimentary there aught to be at least some sort of permanently coupled brakes… even if just a drum brake on the front drive shaft.

 

[whitetiger]

I repaired one a year ago with the same symptoms. I made the mistake of disengaging the front axle propeller shaft and backed down a gravel hill at about 120 MPH. OK, maybe 10-15 MPH, but it seemed a lot faster with no brakes. When it finally stopped, I shifted it back into 4x4 and we had brakes.

It split one of the "A" gears and damaged the carrier.

 

[TheOldHokie]

I repaired one a year ago with the same symptoms. I made the mistake of disengaging the front axle propeller shaft and backed down a gravel hill at about 120 MPH. OK, maybe 10-15 MPH, but it seemed a lot faster with no brakes. When it finally stopped, I shifted it back into 4x4 and we had brakes.

It split one of the "A" gears and damaged the carrier.

Complete new differential?

Dan

 

[hagrid]

Those spider gears should have "for lawn use only" engraved upon them.

 

[Tuckntruck]

I repaired one a year ago with the same symptoms. I made the mistake of disengaging the front axle propeller shaft and backed down a gravel hill at about 120 MPH. OK, maybe 10-15 MPH, but it seemed a lot faster with no brakes. When it finally stopped, I shifted it back into 4x4 and we had brakes.

It split one of the "A" gears and damaged the carrier.

That’s exactly what I am expecting to find.

 

[hagrid]

Many pics, plz!

 

[Bearcatrp]

Wow, that sucks. My 1880 has a 23S rear end from looking at the tag. Hoping yours is an isolated incident. Just went over 200 hours.