B2150HST Splitting Help

[NorCalOrange]

Have to split the tractor and replace the propeller shaft ball joint on a B2150HST per this thread.

http://www.orangetractortalks.com/forums/showthread.php?p=328792#post328792


I have watched some vids and read a few threads. It seems every split is a bit different and some of the details and decisions may not be the best approach for this tractor.

At this time, I plan on replacing the propeller shaft ball joint only. No interest in replacing the clutch or throw-out bearing.

With that, how should I split the tractor - transmission or bell housing? I have read people doing both ways.

I posted two pics. One of the FEL bracket and the other of a hydraulic hose. Is removing the bolts labeled "B" the best way to unbolt loader frame from tractor frame? I am unsure about the hydraulic hose as I have no idea how robust the parts are that it attaches to.

Does the console have to be removed? .

Please keep in mind that I do not have power tools or a compressor and everything will be done by hand.

I have a very strong motorcycle lift for supporting and rolling the front half. I do not have a way to raise or support the engine with a hoist or chain. It should not require more then 2 inches of separation to r&r ball joint? At least this is what one person showed in his vid.

Also, I left the brush hog attached to the 3 point. I hope this was a good idea.

Lastly, apologies for the noob questions. Just trying to minimize surprises and mistakes.

 

[AllDodge]

Have not worked on your model, just some comments
When the tractor comes apart it needs to be supported on both ends. Depending on where the weight is, it can fall down or flip up.

Keeping the bush hog attached may help or hinder, don't know, again its how its weighted. May come apart but have issue going back together

The FEL bracket is heavy and all those bolts would need to be removed.

When putting back together, do you have a torque wrench?

Look here to get the WSM
http://www.kubotabooks.com/AutoIndex/index.php?dir=Tractor%20Owners%20Manuals/

 

[D2Cat]

NCO, as stated you will need to get than loader support off because it connects the two parts you're wanting to separate!

Two thoughts. Be sure to wash down the engine/transmission, peddles, everything before you start. Just makes for easier bolt removal and less chance of the dirt getting in the wrong place.

Your separating the tractor but only replacing the bad joint. You don't need power tool, compressor, etc. Just methodically remove lines, bolts, etc. that connect the two parts you want to separate. It's really that simple! Use a system to put the removed hardware so you know where it goes when putting it back together. Containers, cardboard with holes for the bolts, styrofoam for bolts...just some system.

After you get the engine ready to move you've done the tedious part, and overcome your apprehension! You also now can set back and ask yourself if you would do it again for $250. Yea, that's about what you'd spend replacing the clutch, pressure plate, throw out bearing and the pilot bushing.

 

[NorCalOrange]

NCO, as stated you will need to get than loader support off because it connects the two parts you're wanting to separate!

Two thoughts. Be sure to wash down the engine/transmission, peddles, everything before you start. Just makes for easier bolt removal and less chance of the dirt getting in the wrong place.

Your separating the tractor but only replacing the bad joint. You don't need power tool, compressor, etc. Just methodically remove lines, bolts, etc. that connect the two parts you want to separate. It's really that simple! Use a system to put the removed hardware so you know where it goes when putting it back together. Containers, cardboard with holes for the bolts, styrofoam for bolts...just some system.

After you get the engine ready to move you've done the tedious part, and overcome your apprehension! You also now can set back and ask yourself if you would do it again for $250. Yea, that's about what you'd spend replacing the clutch, pressure plate, throw out bearing and the pilot bushing.

Yeah, the clutch thing may happen once everything is apart. lol

Regarding the FEL support, I was thinking it would provide better balance so the engine wont flop and provide leverage to align things. This guy left it on and said it helped him on his B2150:


"..... I recently had the pleasure of spitting my B2150 and replacing the 2 stage clutch. ....
.... In the end, I unloaded the loader but left the frame in place. It served very nicely to provide support points to keep everything up and in place while working as well as tweaking to realign and assemble. ... "

http://www.orangetractortalks.com/forums/showpost.php?p=170867&postcount=8

 

[North Idaho Wolfman]

That's not a stock FEL subframe, and that subframe may or maynot get in your way.

But you could start by taking both A and B bolts out and look underneath as most will also have a pair of bolts that run up into the bottom.

If it does get in your way you can simply remove it.

With removing any hydraulic lines, try and support/hold the line when removing any fittings, also keep an eye on the line so that it does not turn and bend when pulling fittings like banjo bolts.

Also you didn't take my advice on building a deck to work on it, but your at least going to need a strip of heavy plywood or good planks to be able to put a floor jack on to be able to roll the front forward and backwards on.

And like D2Cat had said make sure you block the front axle to the frame to keep the front from tipping side to side.

 

[SidecarFlip]

Sometimes I chuckle when I read a thread where you give advise and the poster completely disregards it, not like it's your first rodeo. You have infinite patience I will say that.

 

[SidecarFlip]

"Yeah, the clutch thing may happen once everything is apart. lol"

To me that is a no brainer. To leave the old parts in there is like taking a shower and putting back on your dirty underwear.

 

[NorCalOrange]

I dont have a truck anymore so buying plywood to make a platform was not possible. I do have a few large pieces of plywood for the jack to roll on and to place under floor jacks that will support the trans.

Please keep the advice and suggestions coming. I am listening and no "complete disregard" going on


Had time yesterday and tore into it a bit. Hydro line, steering linkage tie rod end and of course the bell housing bolts are all that are left.

Ended up removing the loader frame. It has two notches that go around some linkage. In order to clear the linkage, the frame would have to be lowered in the back a bit and can not be pulled "straight/level" with the engine. Lowering it to clear the linkage would put stress in the propeller shaft and make things more complicated imo. Removing it definitely provide more room underneath and less weight to deal with when rolling the front half of tractor. Also, 5 of the 6 front loader frame bolts were completely lose 1+ turns. The 6th bolt was only snug.


Is it best to bite the bullet and drain the hydro fluid before removing the lines? I "think" the hydro lines sit below the hydro tank and it will just drain anyway. I recently replaced the fluid and filter which was obviously poor timing...


Does everyone support the engine with a floor jack by placing it under the drain pan? I hate doing it like this but dont see any other way.


Once the tractor is split I will remove the pressure plate and clutch and post some pics. It will be telling about the 650 advertised hours on the tractor. And "we" can decide what to do then.

Thanks again!!

And special thanks to lynn!

 

[Jim L.]

Is it best to bite the bullet and drain the hydro fluid before removing the lines? I "think" the hydro lines sit below the hydro tank and it will just drain anyway. I recently replaced the fluid and filter which was obviously poor timing...

Drain into something you can keep clean. Cheaper to buy plastic than hydraulic fluid. If you are concerned about getting it back in the machine you can get a small hand pump.

 

[D2Cat]

"Does everyone support the engine with a floor jack by placing it under the drain pan? I hate doing it like this but dont see any other way."

That will be fine, with the jack under the oil pan, just have a piece of wood between the jack and the pan (1x4 or something like that). That will spread out the weight and also keep the jack from sliding on the pan.

 

[SidecarFlip]

Drain into something you can keep clean. Cheaper to buy plastic than hydraulic fluid. If you are concerned about getting it back in the machine you can get a small hand pump.

What I do when I drain my fluid (and my M's both hold 54 quarts) is, I use an aluminum truck fuel tank I plasma cut a third off which holds the entire load of oil. If I were you I'd go to Wally World and buy a 5 gallon blue plastic water jug (in the RV department) and cut the top off to the height of the bottom of the tractor and just allow enough room to get the drain plug out. That way you can save the fluid and use it again (just change the filters when you put it back in).

I use a windshield washer bottle with the top cut away to dip my fluid out of my cut tank, you could do the same with the 5 gallon water tote. The gallon jug makes it much easier to handle.

With me draining 54 quarts, it's pretty hard to move it around (heavy) so the jug method works for me pretty well.

No point in replacing fluid you just replaced and a normal drain pan won't work, it won't hole enough.

 

[AllDodge]

I would drain it

 

[North Idaho Wolfman]

Drain it and reuse the hydraulic fluid.
Yes supporting the front on the pan is fine, as there really isn't much weight as it's balanced off the front axle.

 

[NorCalOrange]

Im starting to feel like this may actually happen. Sort of... lol I have worked in a lot of vehicles but never split one in half. Much respect to you guys that do bigger tractors without all the amenities of a professional shop.


Just tried removing a hydro line off the Hydro Block. Put some force on it, guessing ~35+ lbs tq, with a 1/2" ratchet and it did not move. Researched the tq specs and its 40-50 lbs. So... do I go for the breaker bar?

Also, do you reuse to seals?

Curious, does the hydro fluid flow through the filter first, last, neither?

 

[Jim L.]

J

ust tried removing a hydro line off the Hydro Block. Put some force on it, guessing ~35+ lbs tq, with a 1/2" ratchet and it did not move. Researched the tq specs and its 40-50 lbs. So... do I go for the breaker bar?

Breaker bar or steel pipe. If it doesn't go easy then I would be using a 6 point socket to keep from rounding off the fastener.

 

[North Idaho Wolfman]

Im starting to feel like this may actually happen. Sort of... lol I have worked in a lot of vehicles but never split one in half. Much respect to you guys that do bigger tractors without all the amenities of a professional shop.


Just tried removing a hydro line off the Hydro Block. Put some force on it, guessing ~35+ lbs tq, with a 1/2" ratchet and it did not move. Researched the tq specs and its 40-50 lbs. So... do I go for the breaker bar?

Also, do you reuse to seals?

Curious, does the hydro fluid flow through the filter first, last, neither?

New O-rings and copper seals.
Through the filter first, it's on the suction side of the system.

 

[NorCalOrange]

Had some time today and split the tractor. Attached pics of measuring clutch plate thickness. The service manual says the "allowable limit is .3mm. from clutch disk surface to rivets."

Also posted a pic of the propeller shaft ball joint. How exactly does it get removed? I though that it would spit apart by removing the c-clip, then the rear half of the ball joint could be separated from the front half. This would provide access to the pin holding the front half and then both pieces could be removed. Then propeller shaft could be pulled forward through the bell housing. Well, the c-clip is removed but the ball joint did not come apart.

Another thought is that the clutch pedal assy needs to be removed. Remove throwout bearing. Slide throwout bearing tube ( dont know what to call it) rearward, towards trans, through the bell housing. Then the propeller shaft with ball joint attached can be removed through bottom access hole?

 

[NorCalOrange]

Tried to remove the clutch pedal rod but it will not slide out. It looks like the clutch fork is whats keeping the rode from sliding. I removed the pin, put some PB Blaster on the clutch fork and rod, and gave a few good raps at the end of the rod but it dd not move.

Is their anything else holding it?

 

[North Idaho Wolfman]

Tried to remove the clutch pedal rod but it will not slide out. It looks like the clutch fork is whats keeping the rode from sliding. I removed the pin, put some PB Blaster on the clutch fork and rod, and gave a few good raps at the end of the rod but it dd not move.

Is their anything else holding it?

If you took the cotter pin and the washer off the right side, then no nothing else is holding it in.

So soak the rod were it goes through the clutch fork and work it back and forth a few times.

 

[NorCalOrange]

If you took the cotter pin and the washer off the right side, then no nothing else is holding it in.

So soak the rod were it goes through the clutch fork and work it back and forth a few times.

Ran out of PBB, will get more tomorrow and drown it.

Are you ok with reinstalling the clutch - pics posted above? Does it look like a clutch off a 650 hour HST tractor?

Should the throwout bearing and pilot bushing be replaced given the clutch condition?