Hi, hoping you all can share some of your hard-earned wisdom. I am purchasing a new tractor, MX6000. I'm also getting a land pride box blade to (1) grade and level about .3 acres of former ag (my gal wants more lawn), (2) repair and level existing service trails around my fields (on about 40 acres), (3) Help to create and maintain new trails. I currently dont have any rear hydraulics and know I can do all that without any hydraulic top link. I'm balancing adding this vs the added cost. How hard will I kick myself if I don't get this now, but defer this to later or never? I'm getting conflicting advice locally. Thanks, all, grateful!
Box Blade - Top Link or Not for New Tractor?
- Thread starter Loki
- Start date
I'm assuming you will do quite a lot with your tractor. So, I'd get the hydraulic top link. It will just make almost every attachment on the rear easier to use and more effective.
If you never use the 3-pt for any other implement…. You’ll never miss rear hyds.
But if you change implements from time to time….. some day…you’ll begin to dream about having a hyd top link.
BTDT. (and it cost me $1K to correct that matter on the “cheap“…. by adding a diverter.)
Moral: If you can afford rear hyds…. DO IT.
(when I bought my lightly-used M4700DT…. there were Two of them available locally. Both had only about 400 hrs on them.. One was $18K…and one was $24K but included a grapple. I had zero use for a grapple… and the guy would sell me the tractor without it for only $1K less….i.e. $23K. So, I did the cheap-thing and bought the $18K tractor…. and am happy with it…but not as happy as I WOULD have been if I had a grapple that just sat in the weeds and a tractor with tons of factory-hydraulics.)
this is how I added a hyd top link: https://www.tractorinnovations.com/kubota
Get TnT and you will thank me later. If you are going to have stuff added…get both valves and rams now. Total pain in the ass otherwise.
A hydraulic top link is super handy with a box blade, lets you change how aggressive you're cutting right from your seat, not having to get on and off the tractor. Also makes installing and removing 3-point items tremendously easier, even more so with a quick hitch. @McMXi has a similar MX with many rear remotes. I added rear remotes and top link to my B2650 for a few hundred bucks 2 years ago.
Please read this. This is why you get T&T for your tractor.
So that you can make 3pt adjustments without stopping and/or getting off of your tractor. Let's be real about this. In the real world the majority of 3pt adjustments that need to or should be made simply are not made when they have to be made manually. How many people stop the tractor, get off, make the adjustment, get back on, go for a few feet, stop, get back off the tractor, readjust the 3pt, get back on and go on their way. Stop and repeat again and again. This all takes time and a lot of effort. In the real world, most simply do not do this and because of this, the end result suffers from the lack of adjustments when they should have been made.
You end up with (That's good enough syndrom.)
With the hydraulic top and tilt system these difficult and time consuming adjustments can be made in a split second and can even be made on the move, all from the comfort of the tractor seat.
One thing to be aware of, the Kubota rear remotes tend to have excessive internal leakage, allowing the cylinders to "DRIFT". Be sure that you get cylinders that have check valves on them.
So that you can make 3pt adjustments without stopping and/or getting off of your tractor. Let's be real about this. In the real world the majority of 3pt adjustments that need to or should be made simply are not made when they have to be made manually. How many people stop the tractor, get off, make the adjustment, get back on, go for a few feet, stop, get back off the tractor, readjust the 3pt, get back on and go on their way. Stop and repeat again and again. This all takes time and a lot of effort. In the real world, most simply do not do this and because of this, the end result suffers from the lack of adjustments when they should have been made.
You end up with (That's good enough syndrom.)
With the hydraulic top and tilt system these difficult and time consuming adjustments can be made in a split second and can even be made on the move, all from the comfort of the tractor seat.
One thing to be aware of, the Kubota rear remotes tend to have excessive internal leakage, allowing the cylinders to "DRIFT". Be sure that you get cylinders that have check valves on them.
Attachments
Russell King
Well-known member
Lifetime Member
Equipment
L185F, Modern Ag Competitor 4’ shredder, Rhino tiller, rear dirt scoop
Get the rear hydraulics now not later. I think you should get the ”factory option” valves installed now as you purchase the tractor. Get at least two rear valves installed now and having a third is good investment in the future (but useless for a box blade unless it has hydraulic operated rippers). Two valves will let you use a hydraulic top link and also a hydraulic tilt cylinder to adjust the implements on the fly without having to get off the tractor (or even stop the tractor really).
The hydraulic cylinders can be purchased now from the dealer and financed with the tractor or added later (but getting them now is better). You can purchase custom made cylinders from Fit Rite Hydraulics (member of the forum that posted #6 above).
The hydraulic cylinders can be purchased now from the dealer and financed with the tractor or added later (but getting them now is better). You can purchase custom made cylinders from Fit Rite Hydraulics (member of the forum that posted #6 above).
Fit Rite Hydraulics - fitritehydraulics.com
Manufacturers of tractor 3 point hitch top and tilt hydraulic kits, hydraulic top links and hydraulic side links.
www.fitritehydraulics.com
Thanks, @biketopia, appreciated. Good point on the quick hitch - to clarify, top and tilt is not limited by a quick hitch? I can see where attaching/dropping implements is much easier. Thanks!
@MtnViewRanch Laughing out loud at 'good enough syndrome'. You just described my method. Which is followed by regrets and redos.Please read this. This is why you get T&T for your tractor.
So that you can make 3pt adjustments without stopping and/or getting off of your tractor. Let's be real about this. In the real world the majority of 3pt adjustments that need to or should be made simply are not made when they have to be made manually. How many people stop the tractor, get off, make the adjustment, get back on, go for a few feet, stop, get back off the tractor, readjust the 3pt, get back on and go on their way. Stop and repeat again and again. This all takes time and a lot of effort. In the real world, most simply do not do this and because of this, the end result suffers from the lack of adjustments when they should have been made.
You end up with (That's good enough syndrom.)
With the hydraulic top and tilt system these difficult and time consuming adjustments can be made in a split second and can even be made on the move, all from the comfort of the tractor seat.
One thing to be aware of, the Kubota rear remotes tend to have excessive internal leakage, allowing the cylinders to "DRIFT". Be sure that you get cylinders that have check valves on them.
@Loki, I have the factory Kubota top-n-tilt kit on my MX6000HSTC and I think it's a really good product for that tractor. It's part number L8388A and the price is $1,120 if you order it through sales and not parts at your Kubota dealer. I will say that @MtnViewRanch is extremely knowledgeable about rear hydraulics and sells an even better set up but you'll pay more. I would still buy the L8388A kit if doing it again but wish I'd ordered from @MtnViewRanch when I had the local dealer cobble together a top-n-tilt kit for the M6060. Kubota doesn't offer an equivalent kit for the bigger tractors.
I also run a Land Pride QH10 on the MX with three factory rear remotes and a 4X multiplier from Summit Hydraulics, all with no issues.
Not that I've seen if you get cylinders with the appropriate ends that allow the articulation to occur. I have two rear remotes on my tractor, but only a hydraulic top link currently, but man it's come in soo handy. I'm going to add a tilt cylinder this year.
I don't have check valves on any of the cylinders I run and simply don't need or want them, but to each their own. I have two FD (float detent) valves in the M6060 and one in the MX so they simply wouldn't work for me. I just don't have a problem with cylinders leaking down over a few hours ... big deal.
I know that you don't seem to have any negative issues for what you do with your tractors. Neither do I, the relatively small amount that my units leak down is irrelevant to what I do with my tractors. (mostly grading)
What if your valves leaked so bad that your cylinders were fully extended in less than 5-10 minutes?
I have had many customers with just those issues when they need to hold position for more than a few minutes.
A lot of people (most actually) simply don't want to be concerned with the issue at all.
Easiest issue resolution is to have check valves. There are other ways to deal with the drifting issue, but having the check valves is the easiest.
Hey, you'll get no argument from me, and as I said, "to each their own". I don't have a need for that feature but I understand or appreciate that others do, or at least think they do. You are an actual expert when it comes to this sort of thing and every member who's interested in learning and making the best choice for their uses or needs should absolutely listen to you.
You were tremendously helpful in my effort to add Summit Hydraulics multipliers and Scorpion control grips to my tractors. Had you sold those items I would have ordered from you.
The Best Thing…I have done…is replace my standard Lower Lift Arms with TELESCOPING Lift Arms.
Makes a HUGE difference when changing implements.
Unfortunately, I bought both the telescoping arms and QH. I feel like the QH eliminates the need for the telescoping arms, but maybe I figure out how to use both at the same time.
jyoutz
Well-known member
Premium Member
Equipment
MX6000 HST open station, FEL, 6’ cutter, forks, 8’ rear blade, 7’ cultivator
Add it to your tractor as a new purchase. It will cost much more to do this later. Ask me how I know.
jyoutz
Well-known member
Premium Member
Equipment
MX6000 HST open station, FEL, 6’ cutter, forks, 8’ rear blade, 7’ cultivator
Absolutely. And the MX6000 comes standard with those.
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Anyone curious what “kit” I used to convert my standard lift arms to telescoping… I used the “kit’ for MX9495 lower arms. It was an easy swap-out. (I did not need the telescoping stabilizers…and still have them N.O.S. if anyone needs such to get rid of turnbuckle or non-adjustable stabilizers.)
Here’s a pic (lower pic) of the entire “kit” ….and the top pic is of the stabilizers I’m still offering in the classified https://www.orangetractortalks.com/forums/threads/new-telescoping-stabilizers-for-sale-cheap.67447/
Here’s a pic (lower pic) of the entire “kit” ….and the top pic is of the stabilizers I’m still offering in the classified https://www.orangetractortalks.com/forums/threads/new-telescoping-stabilizers-for-sale-cheap.67447/
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NCL4701
Well-known member
Equipment
L4701, T2290, WC68, grapple, BB1572, Farmi W50R, Howes 500, 16kW IMD gen, WG24
I didn’t get rear remotes and top/tilt out of the gate. It was definitely a mistake. Thought I could get by through the big (to me) grading project I had immediately, and then wouldn’t have enough use for the top/tilt to justify the expense. I did get the “big” project done with the mechanical adjusters. Got off and on to adjust the three point about 500 times. Maybe not that much, but seemed like it.
Previous two tractors I’d spent a good bit of time on grading with three point blades had leveling boxes for the tilt. That’s a mechanical adjuster with a crank and gearbox setup that moves quite easily and can be manipulated from the operator seat on some tractors if you’re moderately flexible. I think that experience misled me into not fully appreciating how much the Kubota tilt adjuster turnbuckle with the little nibs for grips truly sucked for adjusting a 650lb box blade. Had to use a short piece of pipe on the nibs as a wrench to move the adjuster a half turn per stroke. Toplink usually needed a pipe on the too short for hands nibs as well, but at least the toplink was more easily accessible.
So I got through that one project and then realized my list of grading chores was pretty much a copy of your list. Even without a “big” project, I was routinely fiddling with something: cleaning out a silted in ditch, fixing a creek crossing either washed in or washed out after a storm, managing erosion on trails before it became problematic; lots of little touch ups that kept little things from becoming big things.
After about a year with the stock manual adjusters, I got three rear remotes and hydraulic toplink and sidelink. For my use, absolutely incredible increase in efficiency maintain roads and trails. There are also things I can do with the hydraulics you just can’t do with manual adjusters. I can adjust the aggressiveness of cut while moving, so I can transition the boxblade from cutting with the front blade to back dragging with the rear blade without stopping or even slowing. I have a float detent valve and I don’t have check valves, so I can float the sidelink to follow the contour of the ground independent of the tractor. I’m actually kind of surprised I don’t often hear others mention the ability to float the 3 point adjustments as a desirable feature for some operations. I find that ability quite handy. For me, in regard to road and trail maintenance, it’s the difference between a manual screwdriver and a drill/driver. I can’t overstate the superiority of hydraulics for backblade and boxblade use.
For some things I do, hydraulic top/tilt is no improvement at all over standard mechanical adjusters. Stump grinder, skidding winch, chipper, disc harrow, bush hogging flat fields, moving trailers: those are things that are pretty much set it and no need to move it.
In my opinion and experience, if you are routinely doing boxblade or backblade or landscape rake work, definitely get the top/tilt assuming the cost isn’t prohibitive. If you’re only doing things where you don’t need to adjust the 3 point during the job, it probably isn’t worth getting it.
Previous two tractors I’d spent a good bit of time on grading with three point blades had leveling boxes for the tilt. That’s a mechanical adjuster with a crank and gearbox setup that moves quite easily and can be manipulated from the operator seat on some tractors if you’re moderately flexible. I think that experience misled me into not fully appreciating how much the Kubota tilt adjuster turnbuckle with the little nibs for grips truly sucked for adjusting a 650lb box blade. Had to use a short piece of pipe on the nibs as a wrench to move the adjuster a half turn per stroke. Toplink usually needed a pipe on the too short for hands nibs as well, but at least the toplink was more easily accessible.
So I got through that one project and then realized my list of grading chores was pretty much a copy of your list. Even without a “big” project, I was routinely fiddling with something: cleaning out a silted in ditch, fixing a creek crossing either washed in or washed out after a storm, managing erosion on trails before it became problematic; lots of little touch ups that kept little things from becoming big things.
After about a year with the stock manual adjusters, I got three rear remotes and hydraulic toplink and sidelink. For my use, absolutely incredible increase in efficiency maintain roads and trails. There are also things I can do with the hydraulics you just can’t do with manual adjusters. I can adjust the aggressiveness of cut while moving, so I can transition the boxblade from cutting with the front blade to back dragging with the rear blade without stopping or even slowing. I have a float detent valve and I don’t have check valves, so I can float the sidelink to follow the contour of the ground independent of the tractor. I’m actually kind of surprised I don’t often hear others mention the ability to float the 3 point adjustments as a desirable feature for some operations. I find that ability quite handy. For me, in regard to road and trail maintenance, it’s the difference between a manual screwdriver and a drill/driver. I can’t overstate the superiority of hydraulics for backblade and boxblade use.
For some things I do, hydraulic top/tilt is no improvement at all over standard mechanical adjusters. Stump grinder, skidding winch, chipper, disc harrow, bush hogging flat fields, moving trailers: those are things that are pretty much set it and no need to move it.
In my opinion and experience, if you are routinely doing boxblade or backblade or landscape rake work, definitely get the top/tilt assuming the cost isn’t prohibitive. If you’re only doing things where you don’t need to adjust the 3 point during the job, it probably isn’t worth getting it.