Compression in the radiator )Help

[JKP]

Ok,
First let me say stupid mistake on my part. I am in central Georgia and never really thought about the tractor freezing (B7100D), well it did I saw the freeze plug on the head back toward the fuel tank was out so I replaced it. I filled the radiator with Anti-fz then started the tractor. Immediately Anti-fz blew out of the radiator (cap was still off) I shut the tractor off and put the cap on then restarted the tractor. Anti-fz was spraying out of the overflow tube and I believe one other freeze plug may be loose as I saw coolant dripping from the side as well. I love my little tractor but do not want to drop a ton on it. Ideas, Suggestion on where to start needed.

 

[Billdog350]

JKP, has it warmed up enough and did the water get mixed with coolant or removed? If there is still ice in the block, you could have serious issues.

Now assuming you have water/ice out and coolant in the system now, and you have properly bled the air out of the system....there are really only a few things that it could be.

A cracked block or head will cause compression to get into your water jacket/coolant.

A broken water pump (internally) will also behave similar to how you discuss because there will be hot spots on the motor that will overheat and turn to steam, causing pressure and spraying of coolant.

Next check should be a compression test to see if all cylinders are the same or if you have 1 or more that are down.

Hoping your freeze didn't cause a ton of $$$ of damage! Lesson to everyone on the forum, even in Florida, you should run at least a little coolant in your machine for corrosion prevention, as well as freeze prevention.

 

[JKP]

Billdog,
No ice in system, the pressure is instant right at the start and continues doesn't even have time to warm up to expose hot spots. The motor runs fine, but regarless of rpm the pressure continues to push coolant out, any chance this is a head gasket or not. I agree about the coolant, this was mixed 25c/75w, 19deg and blowing wind two nights.

 

[North Idaho Wolfman]

Sadly it sounds to me as the motor has some serious damage!
The chances of it being a head gasket are super rare, it's more likely a cracked head, or worse yet cracked block.
There is no water pump on that model, so the pressure is all compression pressure that's getting set to the water jacket and then to the radiator.

 

[85Hokie]

Ok,
First let me say stupid mistake on my part. I am in central Georgia and never really thought about the tractor freezing (B7100D), well it did I saw the freeze plug on the head back toward the fuel tank was out so I replaced it. I filled the radiator with Anti-fz then started the tractor. Immediately Anti-fz blew out of the radiator (cap was still off) I shut the tractor off and put the cap on then restarted the tractor. Anti-fz was spraying out of the overflow tube and I believe one other freeze plug may be loose as I saw coolant dripping from the side as well. I love my little tractor but do not want to drop a ton on it. Ideas, Suggestion on where to start needed.

first ......
there is nothing to pressurize the system that fast !!!!! there is no water pump..........so to be squirting out like that means there is compression coming from somewhere.........

I am with Wolfman - the cylinders are blowing the fluid out , that mean you have a crack(s) in the water jacket.......if so - aint gonna be cheap to fix.

 

[JKP]

My guess too, I guess my little mint condition tough guy with 1600hrs will end up in the scape yard if its the block.

 

[ShaunRH]

My guess too, I guess my little mint condition tough guy with 1600hrs will end up in the scape yard if its the block.

Naw, there are a ton of units that have suffered far worse here and come back. It may need a new motor or block, or even a used one, but I'd never call it hopeless. Some blocks can be repaired if the damage isn't too intense.

Really, it will be a judgment call on your part on if it's cheaper to fix it or part the unit out and replace with another.

 

[JKP]

I hear ya, but its not worth 1500-2500 for repairs or a new block. I love the tractor but sometimes it just isn't worth it. I'll go through and see if its a head but I doubt it with my luck.
J

 

[Diydave]

Might just be a head gasket... If you are gonna take it apart, anyway it aint any more trouble to look there, too.

 

[Tooljunkie]

Could be just a gasket,wont know til you pull the head. Freeze plugs usually do their job, curious-what did the temp drop to?minus 5 celcius (23f) is the line for freezing and cracking something. Hope its not too serious, would be a shame to lay that tractor to rest.

 

[JKP]

Tooljunkie,
Temp dropped down to 19deg F two nights in a row, but the wind chill was around 5deg f, it never got above 30 in the day. Never had it happen before so not sure why this time other than bad luck. I will check the gasket too, but its a lot of compression.
J

 

[Tooljunkie]

If its that much, before pulling head, i think i would pull glow plugs and pressure test cooling system. At least it will give you an idea what cylinder too look at. It will be the one with the coolant in it. But it has to be dried and oiled up to prevent rusting.

 

[North Idaho Wolfman]

If its that much, before pulling head, i think i would pull glow plugs and pressure test cooling system. At least it will give you an idea what cylinder too look at. It will be the one with the coolant in it. But it has to be dried and oiled up to prevent rusting.

A cracked head or block can hold pressure that you can put on the radiator and cooling system and will fail under the pressure of compression which is way higher.

 

[Tooljunkie]

I figured if it leaks that bad, theres a good chance it will leak coolant into combustion chamber.

 

[nzzshl]

I figured if it leaks that bad, theres a good chance it will leak coolant into combustion chamber.

Newbie here to the site....hello to all! Reading this post makes me wonder that if there's coolant leaking into a cylinder at a significant rate, cranking might not be an option for fear of bending a connecting rod. Maybe if there's enough pressure relief that won't happen. Only takes a teaspoon or two of fluid for damage to occur. Then again, maybe I'm the one that's all wet.

 

[North Idaho Wolfman]

Newbie here to the site....hello to all! Reading this post makes me wonder that if there's coolant leaking into a cylinder at a significant rate, cranking might not be an option for fear of bending a connecting rod. Maybe if there's enough pressure relief that won't happen. Only takes a teaspoon or two of fluid for damage to occur. Then again, maybe I'm the one that's all wet.

You are exactly right, if the cylinder gets water in it, it will almost certainly lock the motor up, and yes in the right circumstance it could damage parts.

 

[JKP]

Little late for that I didn't know I had an issue until it was already running. Motor started and had no issue with idle or throttle increase only noticed because of the stream of glycol spraying out the overflow tube. I will get to it after I finish the other two projects I already had in the works, will let you know what I find.
J

 

[hampshireborn]

I Have a similar problem I did put a posting on here but no one ever replies mine blows the water out of the over flow pipe from the header tank when hot but it does not empty out the radiator....strange

Little late for that I didn't know I had an issue until it was already running. Motor started and had no issue with idle or throttle increase only noticed because of the stream of glycol spraying out the overflow tube. I will get to it after I finish the other two projects I already had in the works, will let you know what I find.
J

 

[85Hokie]

I Have a similar problem I did put a posting on here but no one ever replies mine blows the water out of the over flow pipe from the header tank when hot but it does not empty out the radiator....strange

I had the same problem .......

1st thing I did was NOT fill the radiator all the way, allow a little bit of air at the top, fill until the top of the cooling fins are covered, no more.

2nd, I kept adding a little here and a little there of fluid, fluid was not a 50-50 mix, it was more straight ethylene glycol.....I got the mixture off. I have read that getting NOT enough water in the system throws it out of whack, dont understand but read somewhere that 70-30 was ideal (water-EG)


EDIT :

JUST NOW looking up ....curiosity kicked in !

Quote from ol wiki :

A 50/50 mix by mass has a specific heat capacity of about 3140 J/kg C (0.75 BTU/lb F) three quarters that of pure water, thus requiring increased flow rates in same system comparisons with water. Additionally, the increase in boiling point over pure water inhibits nucleate boiling on heat transfer surfaces thus reducing heat transfer efficiency in some cases, such as gasoline engine cylinder walls. Therefore, pure ethylene glycol should not be used as an engine coolant in most cases




I emptied the radiator and little, like maybe a quart, and then added back straight water, the color (this case was orange) was good and the machine never spit it back out.

This spring I plan on adding a temperature gauge via the top hose and monitor the fluid via that. I got to find a better way of keeping all the #@$%#@#$ grass off the screen!

 

[Jim L.]

Yeah, the reason is that water is more thermally conductive than ethylene glycol.

I found this out in a hot Texas summer. Undersized radiator not quite dumping enough heat. Added water in summer, and drained and added more antifreeze in winter. Kept doing that until it got sold.