BX2200 FEL Question

[Underdawg]

Hello all. New Kubota owner, just purchased a used BX2200 and love it. Have a question. Only had it a week, and came with a Backhoe attached. All the loader work I did this week, never noticed anything, however, I removed the Backhoe and put on the boxscraper and this morning, I noticed they loader seemed weaker. I was able to load the bucket full of gravel, but it won't pick the front of the tractor off the ground. I know that it could before i purchased it, as I did this as a quick test. I have noticed a small leak from somewhere as my orange bracket towards the front of the tractor (that holds the MMM) seems to have some black fluid on it after I use it. Overall, everything is working great, just wondering if this is something I need to be concerned with?

Love the site, hope I don't need help very often. New to Kubota and to sub-compact tractors, but the family is loving what this thing will do.

 

[Underdawg]

After reviewing manual, it shows there are hydro lines under frame so I will start there. If there is a small leak will this decrease performance that much?

 

[GWD]

A small leak won't make much difference. However, it doesn't hurt to tighten things up. There are three hydraulic fittings in the middle of the tractor, just behind the tires and under the engine that might need a little tightening. They are easy to get to without a MMM. Don't tighten too much - a little is probably all that is needed.

The FEL on a BX2200 is not the strongest one around - 600 lbs., or so, is the limit. The tractor's RPM is a big factor in its efficiency because of the small 5 gal./minute pump. Try running the engine wide-open and see if that makes a difference.

The load when you first tested the FEL and the most recent use could have been of far different weights. Wetness, composition, looseness, and more could make the difference. It doesn't take much until these small tractor balk.

Oh, and since this happened after you took off the BH, check the hydraulic fluid to make sure the reservoir is full.

Heat is also an issue in FEL performance. As the oil thins it can cause weak performance. Hopefully, you are using a quality oil rather than a "UDT equivalent".

 

[Underdawg]

GWD - I have checked the fluid and added some to it. Using the Kubota Transmission oil as reccommended. I am intrigued by your comment about the heat, and it was after several hours are clearing earth, and topping with gravel. I will go home today and try it first thing.

I will take the MMM off to get to the fittings and check. I think the manual states just over 450lbs.

I know it will do over 400 lbs the way it is.. so maybe worrying about nothing.


Seems to be able to do everything I have needed it to so far. Extremely happy with it.

 

[Underdawg]

And thank you GWD for your response.

 

[GWD]

Thanks. We are all here to help each other.

One more thing that I overlooked. The small hydraulic pump can be "overloaded" (not damaged) by requirements elsewhere on the tractor. Like if the box blade is at the top of its lift, the hydraulic transmission is engaged (pedal off center), the power steering is engaged (being used or turned to a limit). Any of these conditions would divert power from the FEL.

Another trick is to put the transmission in low range to increase efficiency and thus work less hard.

I have a BX2200 as you can see by my signature and these are things I've learned over the years. It is a fine little tractor but needs a bit of understanding of its quirks.

BTW, how many hours on your machine?

 

[Underdawg]

You know what, I had the backhoe on it most of the weekend, and didn't notice it while it was attached. Switched to the box and that's when I noticed. I will check that out..

It has 580 hours on it. Bought it from dealer. Backhoe (woods), FEL, 60" MMM and boxscraper .. It was on consignment from a customer that purchased it there in 2002. I think I got a very good deal. Everything works very well (expcept this leaky problem). However they did tell me about it, and told me they snugged the fitting they thought was the problem. Maybe not the right one. lol

 

[TripleR]

GWD knows far more about these than I, so I can't help there. I have however owned mine since I bought it new in 2003. Things I have learned are try not to leave it out in the weather as the switches can corrode, had to have mine replaced. Check your HST fan, mine got broken even with the MMM on, now I used it pretty hard. I now have underbelly plates on both ours as well as wheel spacers and replaced the 3PH turnbuckles with those from Stabilworks.

They are very tough little machines and with a little maintenance will last a very long time.

They are really easy to service too which is a plus.

 

[Underdawg]

Thanks TripleR.. I am new to the tractor setting so all this info is good. I have all the manuals for everything so hopefully with that and youtube, and this site I won't have any issues with maintenance. 600 hours is apparently a big maintenance job, so I will see what I can do.

 

[bandaidmd]

I'm not sure if your 3ph control is spring centered or not but always move it to the center after setting the height of your implement. That way it doesn't steal any of your hydos capacity.

 

[Underdawg]

Yeah, I assume your speaking of the lever for the PTO? It's not spring loaded you have to move it back to center. I don't like the squeling so I always move it back. Even if I move it back to center, is there still a load on the Pump?

 

[GWD]

Yeah, I assume your speaking of the lever for the PTO? It's not spring loaded you have to move it back to center. I don't like the squeling so I always move it back. Even if I move it back to center, is there still a load on the Pump?

Hmm...I think bandaidmd is referring to the 3PH lifting and lowering lever. It is spring loaded and should return to the center after reaching the limit - either raised limit or lower limit.

Try lifting your box blade, remove your hand from the lever, the blade should continue rising, and the lever should pop back to center once the blade has gotten to the highest point. The pump may whine just a bit as it reaches the top but then should automatically shut off and the lift handle should return to center. If it doesn't then there are adjustments to be made to the spring tension. The spring is behind the right rear wheel and can be accessed from the rear. Taking off the wheel makes it far easier.

The adjustment is not easy to fine-tune but it can be done with patience. There are two springs on the control shaft - one for returning to center after raising, the other for returning to center after lowering. It is just trial-and-error to get them functioning perfectly.

If at any time you are hearing a significant whine in the hydraulics then it has gone into relief mode and hydraulic power will be about nil. This is different than the operational whine that these tractors produce.

BTW, bandaidmd makes a good point. Wish I had posted it earlier.

 

[Underdawg]

Hmm...I think bandaidmd is referring to the 3PH lifting and lowering lever. It is spring loaded and should return to the center after reaching the limit - either raised limit or lower limit.

Try lifting your box blade, remove your hand from the lever, the blade should continue rising, and the lever should pop back to center once the blade has gotten to the highest point. The pump may whine just a bit as it reaches the top but then should automatically shut off and the lift handle should return to center. If it doesn't then there are adjustments to be made to the spring tension. The spring is behind the right rear wheel and can be accessed from the rear. Taking off the wheel makes it far easier.

The adjustment is not easy to fine-tune but it can be done with patience. There are two springs on the control shaft - one for returning to center after raising, the other for returning to center after lowering. It is just trial-and-error to get them functioning perfectly.

If at any time you are hearing a significant whine in the hydraulics then it has gone into relief mode and hydraulic power will be about nil. This is different than the operational whine that these tractors produce.

BTW, bandaidmd makes a good point. Wish I had posted it earlier.

Thanks all. I looked under today and I think figured out what the oil is from. It looks like its coming from my differentail or axle from the front. Looks like a seal or something there right on the back, and in the middle of the axle.

Also, my pto control shaft does not spring back. the rubber around the shaft is ripped and catches some but I just bump it and it springs down to center.


So.. It still will barely just pick my front wheels up, and I have a leak in the front Diff.

I am more concerned with the power loss and thoughts. Any idea on the seal, or is that white cap looking thing something else. lol

That takes 80/90 weight right?

 

[GWD]

Thanks all. I looked under today and I think figured out what the oil is from. It looks like its coming from my differentail or axle from the front. Looks like a seal or something there right on the back, and in the middle of the axle.

Also, my pto control shaft does not spring back. the rubber around the shaft is ripped and catches some but I just bump it and it springs down to center.


So.. It still will barely just pick my front wheels up, and I have a leak in the front Diff.

I am more concerned with the power loss and thoughts. Any idea on the seal, or is that white cap looking thing something else. lol

That takes 80/90 weight right?

The front axle can take gear oil. Others, including the factory, use HST oil. I prefer gear oil.

Photos may help explain the seal/white cap thing.

I think we need to clear up the "PTO control shaft" thing. PTO controls are the smaller lever that has several stops as well as gear icons. It is used to activate the MMM and PTO shaft that come out of the rear of the tractor. That lever is on the left side of the tractor.

The 3 PH lever is the large one on the right side that has a long throw and raises and lowers the 3 PH (along with your box blade). It should always be in the middle when done lifting and/or lowering.

To check the FEL, put the bucket on something large and level - like a stump that is slightly above ground level. And BE CAREFUL.
>Set the engine RPM to full (WOT) and move the joystick to power down the bucket (lever forward but not all the way to float). That should lift the front end of the tractor - don't go more than a few inches.
>Then set the tractor back down by lifting the bucket.
>Next curl the bucket downwards (dump, or lever to the right). That should also raise the tractor's front end. Once again, only go a few inches.

If it can't do that then there may be a problem with the hydraulics. But since you said it was fine when you first bought it then there is likely another issue somewhere.

Does the 3 PH struggle to lift the box blade?

As I recall you tested the FEL with the BH on. The issue arose when the BH was taken off. Putting the BH back on and trying again may bring some enlightenment.

The installation of a BH on some tractors involves a diverter valve that has to be opened/closed to operate the BH. It greatly affects the use of the hydraulic pump. If the valve exists and is in the wrong position then you have your answer (let's hope for a simple fix)! OR...you may need to connect the input/output valves that the BH's hydraulic hoses fit into to get a complete circuit of flowing hydraulic oil.

However, the BH may be driven off of the PTO and have its own pump. That should not affect the tractor's hydraulic performance.

I don't have a BH on my BX so someone else will have to chime in on that one. Maybe the dealer would know.

Sorry, I seem to have raised more questions than I answered.

 

[Underdawg]

Ok, I get what the PTO control shaft is. I will try that with the FEL. The BH doesn't run on its on pump uses disconnect lines. I took this from the manual. It's right below the drain plug on the engine, and it's not leaking from the engine. Tomorrow or Wed I will try to get the backhoe hooked back up.

No issues with lifting box scraper either.

 

[bobkeyes]

A couple of thoughts. I have a 2200 also. With everything in Neutral, transmission, 3pt, etc, and the brakes off, mine will not lift the front end but about a 1/2" at a little more than idle. At about 1/2 to full throttle it does fine. If you put it in gear, low or high, it will not lift the front end. If you stall out the 3pt, it will not raise it. Or, and this one fooled me a long time, if the brake is set it will not lift the front end. I guess the wheels have to roll for it to raise.

Like I said, when all the conditions are met it'll raise her as high as the cylinders will go. And, like you I love my 2200!

 

[crabhab]

Underdawg,

The axle pivot bushing is leaking on your bx. It is fixed by removing axle and using a bushing removal bit cracking bushing without damaging axle housing and replacing bushing and o rings. My 2003 bx1500 is going to the dealership to have this serviced.

Sent from my Nexus 7 using Tapatalk 4

 

[Underdawg]

Underdawg,

The axle pivot bushing is leaking on your bx. It is fixed by removing axle and using a bushing removal bit cracking bushing without damaging axle housing and replacing bushing and o rings. My 2003 bx1500 is going to the dealership to have this serviced.

Sent from my Nexus 7 using Tapatalk 4

Crab- How much are they going to charge you for this?

 

[bandaidmd]

I reread your first post where you stated
" I removed the Backhoe and put on the boxscraper and this morning, I noticed they loader seemed weaker. I was able to load the bucket full of gravel, but it won't pick the front of the tractor off the ground. I know that it could before i purchased it"
Naturally if you have a backhoe hanging off the back of your tractor it will be much easier to lift your front end than without.

 

[Underdawg]

Good point..

I spoke to Dealer I purchased it from, and he want's me to verify tightening the pivot bolt first before we try replaceing the bolt.

His troubleshooting involves getting the front end off the ground and verifying if I can push the axle down at all. If any play bolt needs to be tightened.. Thoughts? I like this dealer very much, but I want to make sure he's telling me correctly..