Traded my L2501 HST for a Kioti DK4210SE

nota4re

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Case 580M Turbo; Kioti DK4210SE-CH; Kubota L2501 (Traded-in)
Aug 16, 2019
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Newhall, CA
Posting this here by no means to bash the Kubota L2501 as I think it is simply a great tractor for the money - and it served us well for the last 2 short years. But, as our first tractor, we learned quite a bit and unlike 2-years ago, we now know more about our needs and priorities. It doesn't need to be said that OUR priorities and uses may be different than yours, but let me explain why *we* chose to upgrade to the Kioti DK4210. I'll get into some more details, but I think if there was one primary reason, I would have to say it was the loader lift capacity limitations. In our use, we don't have a forklift so the tractor needs to cover this task. It should be noted that small tractors in general don't hold a candle to a forklift, but it is what it is - and this is one of our uses, if only occasionally. In this area, the L2501's modest 1131lb lift was often well short of what was needed. Time and time again, we found ourselves unloading pallets - whether it be landscape rocks, fertilizer or even a modest-size pallet of solar panels. Ugh, it is simply no fun at all to have to un-stack and re-stack pallets just to accommodate the low lift capacity. (Meanwhile, God forbid, your best buddies are asking why you even have a tractor.)

In contrast to the L2501's 1131lb limit, the DK will lift a whopping 2474lbs - slightly more than twice what the Kubota can. The L2501's loader lift capacity also was evident when we were scooping a pile of delivered decomposed granite and carting it off to another location. Place the bucket down and drive the Kubota into the pile in order to get a full scoop... only the Kubota would struggle to rotate/ lift the bucket up until you backed up a bit. Did it get the job done? Heck yeah, it did. But it would remind you that it is a small tractor. Also, and what some seem to overlook, is that when you are at or near these modest lift capacities, the shared system with the power steering often make it difficult to turn the steering wheel.

In terms of the 3-pt attachments we use with the L2501, it was hard to find fault with the Kubota's performance. We have a large 66" rototiller and a 60" brush hog and the 2501 never seemed to struggle as long as we kept the RPMs at the PTO mark. The 2501 is also a real fuel miser and it seemed like we only filled it a few times in its brief 60-hour time with us.

In terms of smaller gripes that I would bring to the attention of new prospective buyers, there are a few. Starting with the real minor.... geez, Kubota, man up and put a second handle on the rear fender.... and while we're at it, please make the bucket-level gauge standard too. A little frustrating for the newbie buyers like us to have to go out and buy those and because of their instant usefulness, wonder why they didn't come as standard equipment.

Not quite sure if there's an easy solution to this but each time you drive the 2501 you get a pretty good dose of diesel exhaust fumes. We really hadn't anticipated it and thought it was a nit at first, but it DID at time become annoying. Other gripes: I'm 6'-2" and 250 and I found that the operating station was a little cramped and, in particular, I could never find myself getting used to the combined forward/back pedal. This was most noticeable when trying to back up to an attachment - twisted around in the seat, and trying to use your heal to gently back up. I'm not a fan. Yes, one solution is to lose 50lbs and get in better shape but I bought the tractor because I AM lazy!

OK, why the Kioti DK? Like the L2501, another good value. A LOT of tractor for the money. More HP. MUCH more front loader capacity. Roomier work station with flat floorboard and a dedicated pedal for forward and reverse. Oh, and I also decided to splurge and get the enclosed cab with AC and heat.... so hopefully that will help to mitigate exhaust fumes and I'm really looking forward to the AC. 3-pt up/down control level at the back will be very welcomed when switching implements.

I think I got a very good deal on both tractors when I purchased. About $20K for the L2501 with loader and about $32K for the DK enclosed cab (I think about $29K without).

Anyway, I hope this write-up may help someone. Feel free to shoot any questions. I pick up the Kioti next Friday and I'm looking forward to it!
 
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greg86z28

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B2601
May 17, 2020
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Did you shop Kubota the second time around? My guess is the dk4210 is not in the same class as the L01 Kubota.

Either way, congrats on the purchase, throw up some photos and comments when you receive it!
 
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jimh406

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Kubota L2501 with R4 tires
Jan 29, 2021
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I hope the Kioti will serve you as well as the Kubota did. One thing for sure noticeable about the Kioti is how much they can lift. Unfortunately they don’t overbuild the front axle to match. The front axles sure seems small to me compared to a Kubota tractor with a loader that can lift the same weight.

I’ll take the diesel burning fumes and potential headaches vs the emissions headaches. ;) Don’t forget that you can’t just let the emissions tractor run at low RPMs for hours.

But, the real thing that made me go Kubota for me was resale value. I knew that if I didn’t get taken on initial purchase for the Kubota it will be super easy to sell/trade in for a very good price. Maybe some day Kioti’s will as well, or maybe they do in your area.

Have fun with the new tractor and congratulations!
 
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forky

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L2501 HST 4X4 8N
Feb 23, 2021
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It's not a fair comparison at all.....you coulda upgraded to a kubota and have the same happy results....good luck.... I really believe you should of stayed with higher quality....come back and complain in all due time. Saving money will always bite you in real time..... in my opinion.
 
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PaulL

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Nothing wrong with a Kioti. A Kubota has a bit more heritage, generally costs a bit more. That's the choice you make. Dad has a big Kioti and he really likes it.

A DK4210 is a 38HP machine with a 1.8L 3 cylinder, says it lifts 1700lbs to full height (at the pins).

That's a bit less lift than an MX, about identical to an L4701, quite a bit less than a Grand L, more than an L3901. I suspect it cost about the same as an L4701? In other words, yup, there are other Kubota models around that same price and HP that might have also been a good upgrade for you. In particular if you were after a cab tractor, the Grand Ls are great machines.
 
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nota4re

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Case 580M Turbo; Kioti DK4210SE-CH; Kubota L2501 (Traded-in)
Aug 16, 2019
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Newhall, CA
A DK4210 is a 38HP machine with a 1.8L 3 cylinder, says it lifts 1700lbs to full height (at the pins).
As I referenced, the DK4210SE has a lift capacity to full height of 2,474 lbs. In contrast, the Kubota MX series is 2275 lbs and the L4701 is only 1684 lbs. From a price perspective, maybe the L4701 is closest - but the DK4219SE has 50% more front lift capacity. That is significant. Even if you move up to a Grand L, the specs just do not compare. (The total gpm hydraulic flow in the Grand L is 13.9 gpm compared to 16.5 gpm in the Kioti... resulting in less lift capability.)

In contrast to what many of you have suggested, I DID shop the Kubota line-up... there's just nothing close when you are looking at specs versus price. Let's face it, the Kubota's command a significantly higher price for the same specs from a very much earned reputation. I guess the $1M question is if others have matched or exceeded Kubota's build quality & reliability. I suggest you give the Kioti a good look before criticizing because it is not orange! Like most of you, I really like Kubota's - I'm just not married to them any more than I am married to a particular car brand. When I shop a car, truck, or tractor, I want to cast a wide, open-minded net and assess all that is available - factoring in price, specs, reliability, features, etc.

It's not a fair comparison at all.....you coulda upgraded to a kubota and have the same happy results....good luck.... I really believe you should of stayed with higher quality....come back and complain in all due time. Saving money will always bite you in real time..... in my opinion.
Kind of a jaded view.... but, pony up. I chose the DK4210SEHCB. You tell me what Kubota model would best compare - features, specs, price, etc. Maybe there's something I didn't see, but a blanket statement that Kubota is always head and shoulders above anything else is a bit close-minded, eh? One of the influences for my decision to opt for the Kioti was having watched A LOT of youtube videos. There are many people that have the Kioti's (same or similar models) and who, after a lot of usage, are really loving the machines.

Regarding Kubota re-sale, boy howdy! This "feature" sure made the upgrade more palatable (no pun intended). The trade-in value after ~2-years of ownership and 60+ hours was $1500 less than I paid for it! I DO think that will be tough to match from any brand... and hat's off to Kubota for such a well deserved reputation.

I’ll take the diesel burning fumes and potential headaches vs the emissions headaches. ;) Don’t forget that you can’t just let the emissions tractor run at low RPMs for hours.
Yeah, a legit concern that I too share. The diesel fume headaches were a for sure thing on the 2501 and I DO suspect the fumes are significantly less on the L-series higher HP DPF models? Anyway, time will tell how good of a job that Kioti has done with the requisite re-gens.
 
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Nicfin36

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L2501 HST, BH77 Backhoe, SSQA Loader ZD1011 Mower
Jun 19, 2019
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It sounds like you are enjoying your new machine. I looked/considered Kioti tractors. I think there was a dealer not too terribly far from me, but I think they closed before I seriously started tractor shopping.

I have read elsewhere of diesel fumes on the L2501. I have not encountered this on mine.
 

ken erickson

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B7100 hst, 2650 front mount snowblower, L2501 hst qa loader
Nov 21, 2010
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Before I purchased my HST L2501 I seriously considered a Kioti CK2601 HST. The specs and features lined up nicely with the L2501 with a few items that were attractive to me. The Seat in particular was much nicer on the Kioti.
I thought the "build quality" from casual inspection came close to the Kubota in most areas.

As far as pricing , everything I read and watched online told me I would be able to purchase the Kioti for thousands less. I found that NOT to be the case in my instance. Both machines set up the same as far as options came to within $400 dollars of each other .

I have not experienced any negative exhaust fumes when running my L2501.
 
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nota4re

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Case 580M Turbo; Kioti DK4210SE-CH; Kubota L2501 (Traded-in)
Aug 16, 2019
124
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Newhall, CA
It sounds like you are enjoying your new machine. I looked/considered Kioti tractors. I think there was a dealer not too terribly far from me, but I think they closed before I seriously started tractor shopping.
LOL... I don't even get to pick up the new Kioti until end of next week - LOL! I think you make an excellent point about dealerships - their proximity to you and how friendly/knowledgeable/competent they are. In general, I think Kubota dealerships have been around a little longer and far fewer of the fly-by-night dealerships of other brands. Near me we had a larger trailer dealer start selling Mahindras... but they really had no expertise at all and 18 months later, they only have 1-2 tractors on their lot. Good luck if you needed service!
 

Porcupine

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L2501
Jun 15, 2021
125
153
43
NC
As I referenced, the DK4210SE has a lift capacity to full height of 2,474 lbs. In contrast, the Kubota MX series is 2275 lbs and the L4701 is only 1684 lbs. From a price perspective, maybe the L4701 is closest - but the DK4219SE has 50% more front lift capacity. That is significant. Even if you move up to a Grand L, the specs just do not compare. (The total gpm hydraulic flow in the Grand L is 13.9 gpm compared to 16.5 gpm in the Kioti... resulting in less lift capability.)

In contrast to what many of you have suggested, I DID shop the Kubota line-up... there's just nothing close when you are looking at specs versus price. Let's face it, the Kubota's command a significantly higher price for the same specs from a very much earned reputation. I guess the $1M question is if others have matched or exceeded Kubota's build quality & reliability. I suggest you give the Kioti a good look before criticizing because it is not orange! Like most of you, I really like Kubota's - I'm just not married to them any more than I am married to a particular car brand. When I shop a car, truck, or tractor, I want to cast a wide, open-minded net and assess all that is available - factoring in price, specs, reliability, features, etc.



Kind of a jaded view.... but, pony up. I chose the DK4210SEHCB. You tell me what Kubota model would best compare - features, specs, price, etc. Maybe there's something I didn't see, but a blanket statement that Kubota is always head and shoulders above anything else is a bit close-minded, eh? One of the influences for my decision to opt for the Kioti was having watched A LOT of youtube videos. There are many people that have the Kioti's (same or similar models) and who, after a lot of usage, are really loving the machines.

Regarding Kubota re-sale, boy howdy! This "feature" sure made the upgrade more palatable (no pun intended). The trade-in value after ~2-years of ownership and 60+ hours was $1500 less than I paid for it! I DO think that will be tough to match from any brand... and hat's off to Kubota for such a well deserved reputation.



Yeah, a legit concern that I too share. The diesel fume headaches were a for sure thing on the 2501 and I DO suspect the fumes are significantly less on the L-series higher HP DPF models? Anyway, time will tell how good of a job that Kioti has done with the requisite re-gens.
Wut?

Kioti tractors ARE orange. in fact they’re SO orange they were sued for it. ;)

Seriously though congratulations. I bough an L2501 that is working out well for my needs, but was clearly too small for yours.

I bought my mine for within a couple hundred of the offer from the local Mahindra dealer. I liked the Kioti tractors, but eliminated them fairly early on as I have 3 good Kubota dealers within an hour of my place, and two Mahindra dealers in the same radius. Kioti had one about an hour and 1/2 away. Additionally, about 3/4 of the new(er) small tractors I see in my area are Kubota, and there are many of them.

The advice of my feed store owner, who also raises cows was “It’s hard to find a bad tractor under 100 HP.” I think he may well be right.
 

Jchonline

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Oct 28, 2018
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As you say the best advice here is to really think carefully about what you will be doing with the machine regularly and make sure it meets those needs. That way you don't end up needing to upgrade. Enjoy the new machine!
 

Jchonline

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LOL... I don't even get to pick up the new Kioti until end of next week - LOL! I think you make an excellent point about dealerships - their proximity to you and how friendly/knowledgeable/competent they are. In general, I think Kubota dealerships have been around a little longer and far fewer of the fly-by-night dealerships of other brands. Near me we had a larger trailer dealer start selling Mahindras... but they really had no expertise at all and 18 months later, they only have 1-2 tractors on their lot. Good luck if you needed service!
The reason I didnt go Kioti...the dealer also sells used cars, TYM, and LS brand tractors.....no thanks.
 

BigG

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l2501, FEL, BB, Rotary cutter, rake,spreader, roller, etc. New Holland TL80 A
Sep 14, 2018
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Congratulations on your new tractor. A word of caution if I may. They are rating the tractor at 2474 pounds on the FEL. The weight with the cab is 4043 pounds. 2474/4043=61%

The Kubota L2501 is 1131/2623=43%

The amount of weight that you can lift is a big improvement but the weight of the tractor did not go up as much as the lifting ability. So you need to ballast the tractor carefully to have the same sense of stability. Load the tires and add wheel weights in order to lower the center of gravity. As well as use a heavy object on the 3 point such as a ballast box. Check with the dealer as for how big.

The Kioti is a little wider according to what I could find and that will help make it more stable but please use a lot of caution until you learn the difference in the "feel" of the tractors.

I do not know what all the fuss is about the Kioti is orange after all.
 
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TomRC

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Jun 16, 2020
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I researched EVERY brand of tractor for a couple of years before buying a Kubota last fall. However Kioti was second on my list so chances are you will be happy for many years. They make a fine tractor! For me it was clear it was going to be orange one way or the other. I'll be upgrading to a larger heavier tractor in a year of two and I hope......maybe wishful thinking that Kubota will update their L series. Better seat, armrest options, better loader capacity. Seems like a L series update can't be to far out on the horizon.

To the point of price though I am not convinced that Kubota deserves the reputation so many seem to think. What I am convinced of is that many people don't seriously shop all dealers within a reasonable drive that can provide service and explore all promotions / incentives that you can take advantage of through Kubota. I was blown away though at how big of a price difference I saw from the 4 Kubota dealers within an hour of me. May take some extra legwork / research etc but I paid less for my Kubota than a new comparable Kioti. Just got to shop around because Kubota pricing is all over the board from one dealer to the next.

Congrats again on the Kioti, sure you will enjoy it!
 
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nota4re

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Case 580M Turbo; Kioti DK4210SE-CH; Kubota L2501 (Traded-in)
Aug 16, 2019
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Newhall, CA
Congratulations on your new tractor. A word of caution if I may. They are rating the tractor at 2474 pounds on the FEL. The weight with the cab is 4043 pounds. 2474/4043=61%

The Kubota L2501 is 1131/2623=43%
This is a very astute observation combined with sound advice. Ballast will DEFINITELY be important when lifting heavier loads. There is a good video online with a landscape company comparing the lift capability between the DX and NX. Both have similar capacities but the NX is a heavier machine. When max lifting the same pallet weight, the DX was a little sketchy. Definitely something to watch in "forklift" mode. The higher capacities will come in handy with the loader - with more ability to rotate/lift when moving material.

I really like the comments/feedback.

Here's the spreadsheet I had assembled to help me sift through the choices and alternatives. Feel free to point out mistakes - there probably are some.

CompareSummary.jpg
 
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NCL4701

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Congratulations on your new machine. Sounds like you started out with too small a tractor and needed to move to something bigger to adequately address your needs; just took a little while to accurately define what those needs are. Not a criticism. Nothing unusual there.

I worked with undersized, underpowered equipment for many years. It’s a miserable experience. When I went tractor shopping, dealers would ask what I was planning to do with it and then all suggested 25 to 30hp. Maybe because I don’t farm or didn’t explain well, not sure. Fortunately I’d worked enough with tractors in that size range to know what I needed and wanted in size, cab/ROPS, etc. and went with a L4701 instead of a smaller cab unit. If I had listened to the dealers, I’d be trading up now too, or I’d be miserable with yet another undersized machine. There’s a plethora of different sizes, configurations, transmissions, cab/no cab because the job requirements of users are just as varied. For instance in my case I did not want a cab (actually wouldn’t fit at all in a couple of places I have to mow), didn’t need more loader than the LA765, but did need the HP so the L4701 was a good fit. Sounds like you need a little more loader and want a cab. Nothing wrong with that. All tractors are definitely not equal in quality but never got into the Ford/Chevy stuff.

Dealer was a big factor for me on brand. Due to some of the things I do professionally I’ve dealt with sales, service, and parts with every dealer for every brand off and on in my area for many years. Several otherwise quality brands were off the list quickly just because the local dealership doesn’t exactly represent the brand well. The Kubota dealer here was a good fit for me and of course they make quality stuff.

Hope your new Kioti does everything you need for many trouble free years.
 
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wgator

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L4701HST, FEL
Jul 28, 2018
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The only one who matters if they are happy with the choice is you, and it sure seems like you are very happy. If I were you, I would quit what seems like trying to justify you're purchase to others and just enjoy the heck out of it!
 
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nota4re

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Case 580M Turbo; Kioti DK4210SE-CH; Kubota L2501 (Traded-in)
Aug 16, 2019
124
41
28
Newhall, CA
If I were you, I would quit what seems like trying to justify you're purchase to others and just enjoy the heck out of it!
That's totally not it. At 61 years old, I stopped caring what other people think a LONG time ago! Nah, the reason for the post is to help others make better decisions. From my post and others in this thread;

1. Proximity of and knowledge of dealer can/should strongly influence brand choice
2. Try to determine your uses and then weight those capabilities higher when making a decision
3. Collecting the data and putting it on a chart may help narrow the choices
4. Kubota is definitely a good brand - but there's other good tractors too
5. What's best for my needs, may be not be best for your needs

An example (using my chart) is that I liked the L2501 but longed for more loader lift capacity. I think it is fairly easy to see why I chose the DK4210SE over the other options.
 
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