Proprietary universal joint

tunin

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Kubota B1-17, B2410
Jun 23, 2013
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Medjugorje
Hi guys, anyone here from Germany or other EU states where the Kubota B2410 with front pto is sold?

There was a clanky sound coming from the front of the tractor randomly, replaced the front of the front drive shaft for the front pto as it was a bit loose. Put everything together...
Noticed it again, the back of the drive shaft was sturdy.

I took everything apart again, I noticed some movement.
The problem is, the front PTO option was only sold in certain countries in europe.

can not find the part number for the joint or the whole part...

any help would be greatly appreciated.
Thank you.

photos below:
 

kubotafreak

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GRAND l6060, L3560, B6100, gr2100, tg 1860, g1800, g1900, g2160
Sep 20, 2018
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Arkansas, US
What is the cap diameter? Part number of blower/subframe?
The internal style are measured by the interior distance.
 

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tunin

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Kubota B1-17, B2410
Jun 23, 2013
188
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Medjugorje
What is the cap diameter? Part number of blower/subframe?
The internal style are measured by the interior distance.
Hi, thank you for your response, the thing is, the joint does not seam to be replacable, I can not push, pull it out, no safety spring rings. So I can not measure it precisely.
 

GreensvilleJay

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BX23-S
Apr 2, 2019
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I looked at Tractordata to see when made... 2000-2005, though 3 versions.
which one is yours ?
That part may have been used in another 'series' of tractors.....
I'd contact Kubota, or an online 'parts place' to see about a part number
worst case.... find a similar driveshaft, weld the two together,BTDT B4
 
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Dave_eng

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M7040, Nuffield 465
Oct 6, 2012
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I have seen joints assembly and locked in place with a plastic injected into a tiny hole on the yoke.

Either you used lots of pressure to shear the plastic or heated the yoke to melt the plastic

It was not designed to be replaced.

Dave
 

kubotafreak

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GRAND l6060, L3560, B6100, gr2100, tg 1860, g1800, g1900, g2160
Sep 20, 2018
749
224
43
Arkansas, US
Look again more close the inside looks to have external snap rings. They are close to full circumference, so it wont appear like there is a spot to pry.
 

kubotafreak

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Equipment
GRAND l6060, L3560, B6100, gr2100, tg 1860, g1800, g1900, g2160
Sep 20, 2018
749
224
43
Arkansas, US
I have seen joints assembly and locked in place with a plastic injected into a tiny hole on the yoke.

Either you used lots of pressure to shear the plastic or heated the yoke to melt the plastic

It was not designed to be replaced.

Dave
Dave is right, I have run across these on GM vehicles, still replaceable with enough persistence. The other are the staked in kind. These will have little deflections of metal serving as the snap ring. They again can be replaced with enough persistence. Overall the cross T's and cap diameters are readily made, you just need to get it apart. Search for a drive shaft shop if you get defeated.
 

Henro

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I have seen joints assembly and locked in place with a plastic injected into a tiny hole on the yoke.

Either you used lots of pressure to shear the plastic or heated the yoke to melt the plastic

It was not designed to be replaced.

Dave
Dave, I am missing something. If a part is not designed to be replaced, what does one do? Dispose of the tractor when the part fails?

I am totally ignorant about this and just asking to satisfy my curiosity.
 

Dave_eng

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Dave, I am missing something. If a part is not designed to be replaced, what does one do? Dispose of the tractor when the part fails?

I am totally ignorant about this and just asking to satisfy my curiosity.
There are some issues which don't immediately jump to mind when, as an owner with a broken machine, you are trying to fix it for the least cost possible.

The manufacturers' designer and engineers are trying to keep their supply chains as simple as possible

For example. by stocking the driveshaft as a complete assembly, they greatly simplify the number of parts they have to individually track, warehouse, . and distribute.

This strategy also simplifies the manuals and documents they need to provide their distributors and sales outlets. The WSM tells you how to remove and replace the complete driveshaft rather than how to remove and replace both the driveshaft and then individual u joints.

You see this big time with electronics and small appliances. No repair parts are available. If your new TV stops working it is easier for the manufacturer to send you a complete new TV rather than train someone to fix it, and have the parts needed available when your TV stops working.
The bad time is a failure after the warranty expires. Now you cannot get parts and no one has been trained how to fix this particular model with new features. Your only recourse is to buy a new TV.

With new tractors, the electronics running the engine and emission systems are too complicated to most people. With your car when a check engine light comes on, you can buy a cheap OBD2 code reader and immediately get a clue as to what is wrong.

With your new tractor, only the dealer has the software to communicate with your tractor.

In this regard things are only going to get worse!

Dave
 

GreensvilleJay

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BX23-S
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re: The manufacturers' designer and engineers are trying to keep their supply chains as simple as possible

really it's more about PROFIT, the bottom line....
it's far more profitable for to sell a complet $400 alternator than $10 bearing or brushes for it.
same with this driveshaft. You 'should' be able to buy just the 'caps and bearings' sets NOT have to buy a complete driveshaft. Any competent should be able to replace caps and bearings, kinda AUTO101 stuff and just charge the 1 hour labour minimum for either job BUT shop would make far more on selling the complete driveshaft.
 

tunin

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Kubota B1-17, B2410
Jun 23, 2013
188
32
28
Medjugorje
I looked at Tractordata to see when made... 2000-2005, though 3 versions.
which one is yours ?
That part may have been used in another 'series' of tractors.....
I'd contact Kubota, or an online 'parts place' to see about a part number
worst case.... find a similar driveshaft, weld the two together,BTDT B4
B2410 HST bi-turn is the mod of the tractor. for some cointries, they come with the front pto.
 

tunin

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Kubota B1-17, B2410
Jun 23, 2013
188
32
28
Medjugorje
B2410 HST bi-turn is the mod of the tractor. for some cointries, they come with the front pto.
I actually called Kubota Germany where this tractor was purchased, they told me to contact a dealer. I did, they could not help.
 

kubotafreak

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GRAND l6060, L3560, B6100, gr2100, tg 1860, g1800, g1900, g2160
Sep 20, 2018
749
224
43
Arkansas, US
Here is another type, the circle in circle may actually be a rivet of some type that needs to be drilled out.
 

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tunin

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Kubota B1-17, B2410
Jun 23, 2013
188
32
28
Medjugorje
Here is another type, the circle in circle may actually be a rivet of some type that needs to be drilled out.
Thank you for your suggestion, I will most certainly try this.

funny thing is, the side of the tractor of the same shaft has the regular universal joint of hte same size... someone had ot be smart and add this strange shit and it does not sem to be replacable..

I believe this front pto assembly was added in Germany, I have noticed over the past years that German engineering has gone mad, over-engineered overly complicated brakes more often and way overpriced.

i might just Bring this to a machine shop and have it cut out, i will try to source a universal joint of the same size and weld it in... balance it...
 

GeoHorn

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...., I have noticed over the past years that German engineering has gone mad, over-engineered overly complicated brakes more often and way overpriced.
I visited a high-performance aircraft engine shop in Tehachapi, CA where they build/re-build World War Two aircraft engines for Reno Race planes, etc., ... and while there viewed some RR Merlins, Packard Merlins, Allisons, BMW, and others.
It was pointed out that the Rolls Royce-built Merlins had sophisticated silver-plated bearings for longevity. But the American-built (Packard) Merlins did not have some of the finer-points of construction and were not expected to have the same durability of the RR product. The German-built BMW engines however were the most-engineered of all with roller-bearings and needle-bearings on small mechanisms such as rocker-arms, etc. which showed how highly the Germans held engineering and manufacturing processes.
However, it was the American-produced equipment which prevailed because the expensive silver plating and refined needle-bearings were not respected by the Americans who understood that the average combat aircraft-engine would not survive more than a few dozen missions ... so dispensed with expensive and complicated processes in-favor of faster and larger numbers of production.

One of the biggest problems for the Germans was the expensive and time-consuming production of over-engineered equipment while suffering facilities and manpower shortages caused by overwhelming numbers of Allied men and machines.

It’s a lesson I worry we may have forgotten.... while we are spending what the Air Force considers a “low of only” $80 Million for each F-35 fighter.... it costs over $36,000 additional for each hour it flies...and the pilot and support crews required are extensive and hard to replace.

It is projected that five F-5s (an armed T38 trainer) that all-together cost less, will shoot-down an F35. The advantage of that comparison is that 3 of the F-5 pilots will survive while the F35 pilot has only a 50% chance of survival of the projected fight. This means the more plentiful and cheaper Sukhois and Migs and the more numerous surviving Russian pilots who will re-enter the conflict will likely enjoy the same success they had overwhelming Germany in WW2.

Expensive high-tech may be superior to cheaper opponents one-on-one... but sheer numbers of simpler, expendable equipment and sufficient numbers of men to operate them will most likely win-out a full blown conflict.
 
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GreensvilleJay

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BX23-S
Apr 2, 2019
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before destroying the driveshaft, have the machine shop disassemble the 'Belden ujoint'. Then they can machine up the 'guts'( pins, bushings) and reassemble.
Belden Universal is still around, though I suspect a local machineshop should be able to make parts. seems simple..pins and bushings.... basic metal lathe work......
The 'trick' is to get it apart.....rest is easy...
 
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Donystoy

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B7200HST 4WD, B/H, Loader, Tiller, 2 mowers, Post hole, Blade, Blower, Splitter.
Dec 10, 2013
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Binbrook, Ontario
As previously mentioned I would try to find a shop that specializes in drive systems. We have one locally that I had a driveshaft altered for an old car that I restored.
 
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