Does Diesel Fuel Un-gel?

[DeepWoods]

So this is my first winter with a diesel tractor and everything I've read on this forum says to use anti-gel additive this winter which I have already treated my fuel with. My question is if the fuel gels with cold temps, does it un-gel when it warms up again? Is it like water turning to ice, and then back to water, or like adding water to cement, and never going back because of a chemical reaction? Why do I read that people have changed their fuel filter once they have gelled fuel? Couldn't they thaw the filter out and reuse it? Please educate me.

 

[Bmyers]

My understanding, once gelled, it will ungel, but there is a waxy like substance that is left in the fuel that can clog up your filter, which is why the filter needs to be changed.

 

[John T]

Couldn't they thaw the filter out and reuse it?

Yep. I've seen it done many times in big trucks.

 

[Roadworthy]

Yes diesel thaws and yes it can be reused. The process is much like olive oil. At room temperature it's a liquid. Put it in the refrigerator for a couple hours. It's not really solid but it doesn't pour well either. The diesel fuel won't freeze solid it just gets real thick and won't flow if it's too cold.

 

[bird dogger]

So this is my first winter with a diesel tractor and everything I've read on this forum says to use anti-gel additive this winter which I have already treated my fuel with. My question is if the fuel gels with cold temps, does it un-gel when it warms up again? Is it like water turning to ice, and then back to water, or like adding water to cement, and never going back because of a chemical reaction? Why do I read that people have changed their fuel filter once they have gelled fuel? Couldn't they thaw the filter out and reuse it? Please educate me.

Hi DeepWoods,
You'll also find that with that winter front kit that you got from me the engine compartment/fuel tank etc. will stay warm enough that you shouldn't have any problems with fuel gelling....at least while the tractor is in use. While blowing snow in the -20F to -30F and using those covers the snow would actually melt on the top of my hood. An added benefit of the covers....keeping all the fluids (hydraulic, coolant and engine oil) nice and warm. I treat my fuel anyway, especially since it sometimes gets parked in an unheated stall. With my old JD750 if the fuel did start to gel, the rpms would start to slow down considerably and it was the signal to head for the heated shop and add a little more treatment to the fuel. (That was before I started covering the grill and hood in the wintertime here in ND.)

Regards,
David

 

[D2Cat]

Diesel that jells has to return to a usable condition, because I one bought a crawler that had set for about 14 years. I removed the side cover on the IP to make sure the rack was moving when the engine turned over.

It didn't fire right off , but we pulled it with a tractor for about 50' and it bellowed with some black smoke and noise! We never drained the fuel, just added to the tank. I'm sure in the years it sat there that fuel jelled. And the smell of varnish was STRONG!

When diesel was 70 cents a gallon it was better fuel though!

 

[Dave_eng]

So this is my first winter with a diesel tractor and everything I've read on this forum says to use anti-gel additive this winter which I have already treated my fuel with. My question is if the fuel gels with cold temps, does it un-gel when it warms up again? Is it like water turning to ice, and then back to water, or like adding water to cement, and never going back because of a chemical reaction? Why do I read that people have changed their fuel filter once they have gelled fuel? Couldn't they thaw the filter out and reuse it? Please educate me.

Where owners get into trouble with diesel fuel is using summer bought fuel in the winter. Like with gasoline, diesel fuel properties are adjusted as to location and expected temperature. A fuel which will perform well in summer temperatures will do poorly under cold conditions.

If you are buying fuel close to when you need it in small quantities from truck stops which sell a lot of diesel, you will avoid most cold temperature problems.

Dave

 

[dlsmith]

Diesel gels at it's cloud point, and depending on the formulation of the fuel, that can vary by 30-40°F. A summer formulation can gel at 25°F, I've seen it many times over the years. Even winter mix has gelled on me with temperatures in the single digits. Anti-gel additives are cheap insurance in the winter, and I always kept several bottles in each truck and a couple of cases at the shop.

The fluffy stuff floating in the diesel is paraffin that has precipitated out of the solution. Again, the temperature that the paraffin will dissolve back into the fuel varies with the formulation, but it will usually start around 40°F.

I have a truck for sale that was last fueled in mid September, and since the temps around here are going to get down into the teens next week, I added a good dose of anti-gel into both tanks yesterday and took it around the block to get it mixed up and all through the fuel system.

Fuel heaters can help if the truck is rarely shut of and allowed to cool to ambient, but that can also invite an algae infection. Ask me how I know.

 

[DeepWoods]

So the fuel that is currently in my tractor was bought late september, I added anti-gel to it as recomended. Since it was most likely? summer blend, will what I added be enough, or should/can I add more. Can one add too much anti-gel?

 

[dlsmith]

So the fuel that is currently in my tractor was bought late september, I added anti-gel to it as recomended. Since it was most likely? summer blend, will what I added be enough, or should/can I add more. Can one add too much anti-gel?

The ant-gel container should tell you now much to add and to what temperature it will protect you from gelling. But if you added the recommended amount you should be good down to at least 0°F.

Of course where you live 0°F could be considered a warm winter day.

 

[Dave_eng]

So the fuel that is currently in my tractor was bought late september, I added anti-gel to it as recomended. Since it was most likely? summer blend, will what I added be enough, or should/can I add more. Can one add too much anti-gel?

Post the specific info on the product you used.

Then opinions on your current state of fuel can be provided.

Dave

 

[DeepWoods]

Post the specific info on the product you used.

Then opinions on your current state of fuel can be provided.

Dave

I used 2.7 ounces of Power Service in the white bottle to five gallons of fuel. After rereading the instructions, that should cover me to 30 degrees. According to the bottle I should double this amount for temps below 30. We are going to see temps drop to zero in the next few days, so I want to make sure I have used enough anti-gel to not have any problems.

 

[jkcolo22]

Where owners get into trouble with diesel fuel is using summer bought fuel in the winter. Like with gasoline, diesel fuel properties are adjusted as to location and expected temperature. A fuel which will perform well in summer temperatures will do poorly under cold conditions.



If you are buying fuel close to when you need it in small quantities from truck stops which sell a lot of diesel, you will avoid most cold temperature problems.



Dave

True. Treated fuel from the pump works just fine. Diesel fuel additives are specifically NOT RECOMMENDED by Kubota as set forth in the operator’s manual. Why mess with the warranty? I know plenty of people on here do it anyway, but I run straight pump diesel and I’ve never had a problem. And it gets pretty dang cold where I live


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[jkcolo22]

I used 2.7 ounces of Power Service in the white bottle to five gallons of fuel. After rereading the instructions, that should cover me to 30 degrees. According to the bottle I should double this amount for temps below 30. We are going to see temps drop to zero in the next few days, so I want to make sure I have used enough anti-gel to not have any problems.

You can definitely overdo it on the winter additive. Careful... as I pointed out before, the manual on the newer machines says don’t use it at all.


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[sheepfarmer]

Must depend on which newer model? My manual for the L3560 recommends
Cetane boosting additives as needed, and in fact Kubota sells its own version of that, and which lowers the gel point. The 3560 is a common rail engine with a dpf filter to keep clean.

"Fuel Use the ultra low sulfur diesel fuel only, below 15ppm for these engines.
Cetane number of 45 minimum. Cetane number greater than 50 preferred, especially for temperatures below -4 deg F or elevations above 5000 ft."

You can definitely overdo it on the winter additive. Careful... as I pointed out before, the manual on the newer machines says don’t use it at all.


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[N7HEVN]

DeepWoods, hope you'll allow me to piggy-back on this thread, with a question that applies on my side, and of course related to your fuel question.

I have just purchased this year, a property in Oklahoma, which has a 40x40 insulated workshop on it. The shop has two 10' rolling doors, those are not insulated though.
My new Kubota is my first tractor, so this matter of winter-ization and fuel concerns, is of peak interest to me as well.

With having the tractor inside the insulated workshop -
Would you guys still winterize, or put the fuel-treatment in the tractor, and the temperatures will likely not fall below 32-Fahrenheit (Zero Celsius) often?
---and I certainly would not be trying to start the tractor when the temp's would be in the freezing range (I wouldn't even be there at the property, quite most likely)...

 

[sheepfarmer]

I think if your fuel is left over from summer as mine currently is, I would add some cetane boosting additive because we are having weather that is 10 to 15 degrees below average for this date, and it wouldn't be surprising in Oklahoma if some of the polar vortices didn't also come your way this winter.

 

[SidecarFlip]

I think if your fuel is left over from summer as mine currently is, I would add some cetane boosting additive because we are having weather that is 10 to 15 degrees below average for this date, and it wouldn't be surprising in Oklahoma if some of the polar vortices didn't also come your way this winter.

You said a mouthfull there young lady. We went from about 2 days of fall to instant winter here in SE Michigan. Trees lost all their leaves in 2 days. Must be global warming.

I bet we get hammered with snow too. I feel it coming. Sure am glad I don't have to go to work every morning anymore. Can toast my feet in front of the fore and listen to the local news about all the fender benders.

Gave both my M's a healthy shot of Powerservice this morning, just in case.

 

[D2Cat]

N7HEVN, I live north of your questioned area some. It's 120 miles from my place to Coffeeville, Ks. which is on the northern Ok border. I make a special effort to get diesel fuel in any equiped machine topped up AFTER the local station has received winter treated fuel. I call and ask the owner/manager if his fuel has received the treatment.

I have been using my Dodge more lately and it needs to be filled up, but I'm waiting a bit longer because the owner wasn't in when I called yesterday.

All that being said, I have NEVER added any additive to any diesel fuel I've purchased in this manner. I have also NEVER had any problem with an engine starting and running properly with this fuel.

I have 7 diesel powered machines, the oldest being a 1952 Cat, but I don't use it in the winter. But a 1965 Case 730 is used a couple of times each week and fires right off. It does have a 1 amp motorcycle charge on it with a timer which is on for 2 hrs. each day, and a block heater on the same timer. That setup is to insure that one starts to feed hay, and I'm not near any help if it fails.

Everyone's mileage, I guess, varies! YMMV

 

[BAP]

N7HEVN, I live north of your questioned area some. It's 120 miles from my place to Coffeeville, Ks. which is on the northern Ok border. I make a special effort to get diesel fuel in any equiped machine topped up AFTER the local station has received winter treated fuel. I call and ask the owner/manager if his fuel has received the treatment.

I have been using my Dodge more lately and it needs to be filled up, but I'm waiting a bit longer because the owner wasn't in when I called yesterday.

All that being said, I have NEVER added any additive to any diesel fuel I've purchased in this manner. I have also NEVER had any problem with an engine starting and running properly with this fuel.

I have 7 diesel powered machines, the oldest being a 1952 Cat, but I don't use it in the winter. But a 1965 Case 730 is used a couple of times each week and fires right off. It does have a 1 amp motorcycle charge on it with a timer which is on for 2 hrs. each day, and a block heater on the same timer. That setup is to insure that one starts to feed hay, and I'm not near any help if it fails.

Everyone's mileage, I guess, varies! YMMV

I have seen winter fuel gel in many occasions when it gets down colder than 20 below. Nothing like trying to Change fuel filters and thaw out the fuel at 30 below to get the tractor running to feed cows. Block heaters work great to help start the tractor but do not keep the fuel from gelling. A little additive goes a long way to prevent a gelling nightmare.