Bought a 3-point sprayer with PTO driven pump. The only problem I'm having is priming the pump. There is absolutely nothing in the manual about it other than to say "be sure the pump is primed". Gee, thanks. So, what I have been doing to "prime" it is disconnect the outlet hose with only water in the tank. Once I have water flowing, I reconnect it and it works great. The difficulty with this is the way the outlet hose is connected to the regulator valve is a REAL PITA to get on and off. I have the idea of spicing in a tee connection with a valve to simplify this priming process. However, I'm wondering if I'm doing something wrong to begin with? Is there a better way to prime the pump?
PTO driven sprayer question
- Thread starter eiresurg
- Start date
If you have a roller style pump it should prime itself with the fluid coming into it from the tank. Have you made sure the line is open from the tank to the pump, then turn the RPM up to pressurize your nozzles?
As long as u have water in the tank and the water level is higher than the pump gravity will do the rest. Just make sure you have something open on the discharge line so it can flow. Usually there is a recycle/tank agitation line that is open somewhat. You should be good.. If you still have an issue a Picture of the set up would help.
Here is the set-up I am using:
The only differences are I bought a stainless steel Delavan pump rather than a cast iron one. The pump is a 6 roller. And, I do not have the hand nozzle, which is the brass valve connected to the regulator valve in the picture.
The process I have been using is:
1) fill tank half way with water (30 gallons)
2) open valve to boom
3) turn PTO on and gradually increase PTO speed to 300rpm
4) if I do not see output from nozzles after 60 seconds (which is always the case) I turn the PTO off
5) disconnect output hose from pump to regulator valve
6) turn PTO back on until I see flow from pump (usually occurs in 10 seconds)
7) turn PTO off and reconnect output hose to regulator valve
8) turn PTO back on and immediately there is flow from boom nozzles
This has worked every time. Yesterday I sprayed 2 tanks of thistle killer, but had to repeat this process between fills. I have been very attentive to not running the pump dry. There were several times during spraying yesterday that I had to stop and turn the PTO off so I could get out of the tractor to adjust the booms or move some object out of the way in the pasture. Each time there was no issue with restarting the pump. This issue with priming the pump only seems to occur between fills. I can provide more pictures when I get home tonight if you think it would be helpful.
The only differences are I bought a stainless steel Delavan pump rather than a cast iron one. The pump is a 6 roller. And, I do not have the hand nozzle, which is the brass valve connected to the regulator valve in the picture.
The process I have been using is:
1) fill tank half way with water (30 gallons)
2) open valve to boom
3) turn PTO on and gradually increase PTO speed to 300rpm
4) if I do not see output from nozzles after 60 seconds (which is always the case) I turn the PTO off
5) disconnect output hose from pump to regulator valve
6) turn PTO back on until I see flow from pump (usually occurs in 10 seconds)
7) turn PTO off and reconnect output hose to regulator valve
8) turn PTO back on and immediately there is flow from boom nozzles
This has worked every time. Yesterday I sprayed 2 tanks of thistle killer, but had to repeat this process between fills. I have been very attentive to not running the pump dry. There were several times during spraying yesterday that I had to stop and turn the PTO off so I could get out of the tractor to adjust the booms or move some object out of the way in the pasture. Each time there was no issue with restarting the pump. This issue with priming the pump only seems to occur between fills. I can provide more pictures when I get home tonight if you think it would be helpful.
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The pump is not pumping because there is nothing to pump. You have an air lock or fluid restriction.
If you take the intake line at the pump off (when the tank has fluid in it) the fluid should flow out freely with gravity, tractor not running. If fluid does not freely flow you have something in the discharge hose or strainer causing a restriction. Once fluid gets to the pump it should pick it up and build the pressure you set it to. Might increase your RPM speed also, once you know the pump has fluid to pump.
If you take the intake line at the pump off (when the tank has fluid in it) the fluid should flow out freely with gravity, tractor not running. If fluid does not freely flow you have something in the discharge hose or strainer causing a restriction. Once fluid gets to the pump it should pick it up and build the pressure you set it to. Might increase your RPM speed also, once you know the pump has fluid to pump.
Sounds like ur regulator has an issue. There is a spring and plunger that controls ur pressure and it may have issues.Try backing off ur pressure regulator as far as possible and start ur pump. You should have water flowing back to the tank through the recycle line from the regulator. Once u confirm this, drain the tank and see if the pump will prime itself and check for flow returning to tank. Also there is usually a strainer/screen in the pump suction line somewhere u may want to find if it has one just to a check it for obstructions.
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Hi, if you can still return it, do it and get a AR35 or AR45 sprayer pump, they are designed for sprayers and they are the diaphragm type. They do not need to be primed, they can suck water from bellow and even pump the carried tank from a well.
Many sprayer manufacturers around the world use them, you can surely connect one to this tank.
If you need further information, please to ask... this is their US site:
https://www.arnorthamerica.com/pages/diaphragm-pumps/
Many sprayer manufacturers around the world use them, you can surely connect one to this tank.
If you need further information, please to ask... this is their US site:
https://www.arnorthamerica.com/pages/diaphragm-pumps/
Your roller pump should be fine in your setup if as has been said have the tank higher than the pump and open flow. Be sure no hose, especially the suction hose is not being crimped. One suggestion I will make is in stead of using the bib 90 degree elbows on the pump, switch to quick disconnect fittings there. use male on one side and female on the other with matching fittings on the hoses. Reasons to use them that way is so you don't have any issue knowing which hose connects to which side. But when trying to bleed the plump easy to disconnect the outlet hose so the waters weight pushes through the pump but the big reason is for cold weather with freeze concerns easy to remove the pump, also for cleaning the pump. I used roller pumps to spray Roundup years back and they did not last long. Did that and would remove the pump and drop it into a five gallon bucket of used oil. Pumps lasted and lasted. Also if you have more than one sprayer allows moving the pump between them.
I agree with what Palmettokat detailed, with one little add on. When you have had your pump in the oil to protect it from rust and freezing, be REAL sure go get all the oil out carefully, or you will get a bath!
Have the exact same unit you have but with a much larger tank (250 gallons). never had any issues with mine in 8 years, but I don't not apply glyphosate, only 28%.
I agree with you guys, it is just that that pump is not designed for efficient spraying... that is why I suggested the diaphragm type.
The diaphragm pumps keep the flow and pressure pumped no matter what nozzles one uses.
We have used different pumps in our orchards and vineyards, about 10000 trees, we’ve noticed difference when we test the sprayed surface with uv light dependent what sprayer we use.
Regards,
p.s.
sorry about my not good English..
The diaphragm pumps keep the flow and pressure pumped no matter what nozzles one uses.
We have used different pumps in our orchards and vineyards, about 10000 trees, we’ve noticed difference when we test the sprayed surface with uv light dependent what sprayer we use.
Regards,
p.s.
sorry about my not good English..
LOL you are correct! I normally rotate my over so the ports are on the bottom as removing it.I agree with what Palmettokat detailed, with one little add on. When you have had your pump in the oil to protect it from rust and freezing, be REAL sure go get all the oil out carefully, or you will get a bath!
Yes. When I disconnect the output line from the pump, water flows freely through. So, it appears the pump is "primed".
Completely disassembled regulator and diverting valve yesterday. Everything appears to be new, assembled correctly and not damaged. Inspected strainer/trap and that is clean and new.
Was thinking about using the quick disconnects. Is there any reason I can't use brass with various herbicides? All the fittings are polyethylene/polypropylene that came with the sprayer. I figured that was either because it's cheaper or for durability with herbicides/insecticides?
I bought a stainless pump, so should be good with various chemicals. However, I have been vigilant about rinsing it thoroughly.
Did u verify with water that the pump is recycling water back to the tank when the booms are off and the pump is primed and pumping? Take the hose off the regulator that comes from the pump. Keep it elevated where it would normally be. Now try try to prime pump. If the pump primes up then it***8217;s still a regulator/return to tank line issue.
As far as the roller pump goes I used one on an 80 foot farm sprayer for years. They work fine. I stored mine outside so I flushed it with plumbing antifreeze due to winter and it lasted for years.
As far as the roller pump goes I used one on an 80 foot farm sprayer for years. They work fine. I stored mine outside so I flushed it with plumbing antifreeze due to winter and it lasted for years.
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Even with the booms on and spraying you should have enough pumping capacity to be recycling back into the tank. It may be less than when not spraying. If not some chemicals and mixtures will begin to separate.
Where you describe your normal start up procedure: I question if step 2 is causing some issues. With water in the tank, and above the pump, you should be able to start the PTO pump and it should prime. It will (and should) send all the fluid back to the tank via the by pass valve with the spray boom off. The by pass does two functions: you need a certain volume of spray to satisfy the volume and pressure requirements of the spray tips at a certain speed. The pump will (or should) be capable of putting out more than whatever that requirement is, so it has to go somewhere. Hence- the by pass. Sends it back to the tank. Second function of the by pass is to agitate the spray mix. Some stuff mixes and stays mixed pretty good. Others want to turn to cottage cheese. You need good agitation either way. The pressure gauge should read pressure (I tried to trace the plumbing, but I'm 99% that's factual) whenever the pump is running. No matter if its by passing into the tank or spraying via the boom. You need to be able to see the gauge easily from the seat of the tractor. If you can't, either plumb another gauge into the system and put it where you can see it, or relocate the one you have. When your spray solution is almost out, and the by pass is still on, the pump can start to cavitate (or, "starve"). Your gauge will start jumping around erratically. You need to either shut the pump off or , if your goal is to empty the spray solution 100%, shut the by pass off. Otherwise, even though you might think you didn't run the pump dry, you may in fact momentarily done just that. Potentially causing air pockets, or pump damage. A gauge is your friend here. You asked about brass fittings. DON"T DO IT! The poly fittings are generally impervious to most any chemicals you'll use. Use poly anytime you change plumbing.
As Fido Farms said: nothing at all really inherently wrong with a roller pump. When comparing with a centrifugal pump, a roller will put out more pressure but less volume. You really should have low volume requirements for the size pump you have vs the boom and nozzles you have. The roller is cheaper to buy and rebuild. They won't last as long as a centrifugal between rebuilds, but not sure that's an issue with you? We used to run roller pumps, but went to Hydraulic Centrifugals to increase the volumes we needed, we don't really need high pressure. Nice thing about a hyd. pump is that engine RPMS aren't really relevant anymore. Bad thing is the cost to buy and cost to rebuild compared to a roller. You said you rinse the pump after use, that's good. Important on all spray systems. I wouldn't store the pump dry, either. RV antifreeze is safe, and its probably OK to not drain it out when you need to spray again. I dump RV antifreeze in a clean sprayer and run it through the entire system to winterize or store. I used crop oil to store stuff in for a few years, but that was hard on some seals and rubber products, so I quit that. As far a quick disconnects: you can go 2 ways, depending on a couple things. If its a small enough hose, and you want kind of easy use, you can convert to garden hose fittings pretty economically. The gold standard would be to go with something like a Banjo cam lock fitting. That's all I would use at the pump, for example. Little more money, way more durable. Here, my local TSC has a good selection of sprayer parts.