Keeping Bessie II Warm

troverman · Oct 2, 2019

sheepfarmer said:
I think it is dependent on which tractor you have, and how old it is. I have run across Kubota blurbs about redesigned glow plug chambers etc for easier starting. I have no clue as to which models have what. My two, 2013 and 2016 editions are easy to start, dealers told me don't bother with block heaters, and I haven't. If I am not running them long enough to recharge the battery, I leave them on a battery tender and that has been fine. The battery tender use did increase cranking speed on L tractor, but that is an older battery.

We have two Kubota dealers both about 30 minutes away from me. One installs a block heater on every single Kubota they sell, and charge the customer for it. The other dealer doesn't recommend them. At this point I've had four Kubotas, and they have all been stored the same way, in the cold, without a tender or block heater or anything else...and they've all started well. My 2002 L4310 had an automatic glow plug timer and started very well all winter, each winter, right up to when the battery died in *2018*. Very impressive I think.

I'm very fortunate that both my current tractors are very new, and I expect they'll start well for years to come with no special attention.

Freeheeler · Oct 2, 2019

North Idaho Wolfman said:
Why not Schweitzer?
https://www.schweitzer.com/

When I actually make it out to Idaho, Schweitzer is definitely on the list, as well as Pebble Creek, Silver Mtn, and Tamarack. I need to hurry up and make that trip happen, I'm not getting any younger.

Highmarket · Oct 3, 2019

I have the B2650 . I installed the oem block heater myself in about 10 Min. It works great I have it hooked to a WIFI outlet and turn it on about 2 hrs before I get to cabin. I also put on a magnetic heater and stick that on underneath by Hydro filters and that is also plug into the Wifi outlet. I use a Battery tender that's always plugged in. That setup worked great for me all last winter. I don't feel like dealing with a cold tractor after driving 5 hrs and want to get into house asap. For a few bucks it seems to me like the right move. Definitely cant hurt. I treated fuel but cant remember the brand.

torch · Oct 4, 2019

I fear that those of you who believe in the "it starts so it doesn't need a block heater" may be missing an important point.

Engine wear is inversely proportional to engine temperature. Cold engine = high wear. Most engine wear occurs during the time the engine is getting up to full operating temperature.

Yes, synthetic oil can help mitigate the wear (and I use it), but it does not eliminate it completely. Personally, I use block heaters, not because I can't get it started any other way, but to protect my equipment during the process.

I favour in-line or frost plug heaters. I think they are the most efficient, focusing more of their output into the engine. I have a magnetic heater for occasional use where coolant heaters are not an option or insufficient (eg: air cooled engine or heating the oil pan under extreme cold conditions) but I believe that external heaters are less efficient and radiate too much energy away from the engine. As for dipstick heaters, I believe they are way too small with very little contact area to be of any use.

And Gene, while I understand your hesitation to modify your beautiful new tractor, IMHO, a block heater is not "invasive". I think it is "added value".

As for the battery, I have an electric battery blanket. The blanket and block heater share a weather tight splitter so there is just one plug-in for the tractor. I have a small solar panel battery maintainer to keep the charge up at all times.

But that's just my 2¢.

troverman · Oct 4, 2019

Yeah, a lot of wear is incurred on startup, but in fairness, how many Kubota tractor engines are "wearing out?" They aren't. Running all the heaters, additives, and oils isn't going to hurt...but unless you plan on getting 10,000 hours out of your tractor, I don't think you'll ever wear your engine out from too many cold starts. Just my opinion. Most people don't even put 2,000 hours on their engines.

torch · Oct 4, 2019

troverman said:
Yeah, a lot of wear is incurred on startup, but in fairness, how many Kubota tractor engines are "wearing out?"

I'm guessing most of the ones where people post problems with compression, bearing knocks and so forth.

Hey, your equipment is your equipment and if you think you don't need a block heater because you won't use it much, then that's your call. Same goes for Gene. However, since he's new and asking questions it seemed reasonable to point it out.

Personally, I want my tractor to last as long as possible. And while I do use it all year round, the single biggest use is clearing snow, so it sees a lot of cold starts.

Gene Blister · Nov 1, 2019

Hi All! November first already, and I wanted to thank you all for the advice on keeping Bessy II warm and ready to run this winter.

I’ve gone with a “smart” trickle charger from Tractor Supply to keep the battery topped off, and a self-made “snood” for the engine compartment, to keep the heat in and the snow out.

Its nothing more that a piece of plastic sign material, available for any craft supply store. Use the thinnest sheet available, and use the screen as a template to cut the cover for the radiator. It will slide right into the screen’s channels. I put a little foil tape tab on the top edge to make it easier to remove.

For the side panels, trace their profile directly on the sign material, cut out with a box cutter, then tweek and trim until they slip into the inside face of the panel. I kept mine a little larger at the corners so they would stay put just by friction and tension.

I gave this set up a test the other day, during the coldest morning of the year so far. Bessy fired up with a 10 second glow plug charge, puffed just a little white smoke and warmed up to the center of the dial in about 10 minutes!

Thanks again everybody.

SidecarFlip · Nov 1, 2019

troverman said:
Yeah, a lot of wear is incurred on startup, but in fairness, how many Kubota tractor engines are "wearing out?" They aren't. Running all the heaters, additives, and oils isn't going to hurt...but unless you plan on getting 10,000 hours out of your tractor, I don't think you'll ever wear your engine out from too many cold starts. Just my opinion. Most people don't even put 2,000 hours on their engines.

I'd like 10,000 hours on mine. Working on it with 3600 on one and 2600 on the other. neither have block heaters always ambient start, barn has no electricity and it gets cold here.

dlundblad · Nov 2, 2019

I would look into getting a battery maintainer and a block heater.

I have maintainers on everything I have. I wish my L had a block heater, but oh well.

AL A · Nov 4, 2019

Sorry if this is a dumb question, but I've never owned a diesel vehicle of any sort before. Does diesel fuel sold at the pump for over the road vehicles typically have the anti-gel additives and other such stuff?

North Idaho Wolfman · Nov 4, 2019

AL A said:
Sorry if this is a dumb question, but I've never owned a diesel vehicle of any sort before. Does diesel fuel sold at the pump for over the road vehicles typically have the anti-gel additives and other such stuff?

No not typically, you need to treat the fuel.

troverman · Nov 4, 2019

AL A said:
Sorry if this is a dumb question, but I've never owned a diesel vehicle of any sort before. Does diesel fuel sold at the pump for over the road vehicles typically have the anti-gel additives and other such stuff?

Depending upon where you live, at some point in the fall most fuel stations will start to mix #1 Arctic Diesel into the typical #2 Diesel everyone normally burns. #1 diesel is much less likely to ever gel / wax / freeze; however it is less good for your fuel system, since it provides less lubrication to your high pressure pump, etc. At some point in the spring, the fuel suppliers will stop blending #1 and #2 and go back to all #2.

Fuel stations do not add "anti-gel" or other additives to their tanks. That is up to the end user, since not everyone wants additives, nor do they necessarily want to pay for them.

Be advised that just because the fuel has some blend of #1 in it doesn't mean your vehicle / tractor won't gel up. Two winters ago I had this problem with my 2017 Ford F-250. The truck would run but gave me low fuel pressure and reduced power messages before finally shutting off.

I had to replace both fuel filters (about $100) and thaw out my truck. Eventually, the fuel station reimbursed me for three full tanks of fuel and the cost of the fuel filters (very impressed). But it was about -20F as well.

AL A · Nov 4, 2019

troverman said:
Depending upon where you live, at some point in the fall most fuel stations will start to mix #1 Arctic Diesel into the typical #2 Diesel everyone normally burns. #1 diesel is much less likely to ever gel / wax / freeze; however it is less good for your fuel system, since it provides less lubrication to your high pressure pump, etc. At some point in the spring, the fuel suppliers will stop blending #1 and #2 and go back to all #2.

Fuel stations do not add "anti-gel" or other additives to their tanks. That is up to the end user, since not everyone wants additives, nor do they necessarily want to pay for them.

Be advised that just because the fuel has some blend of #1 in it doesn't mean your vehicle / tractor won't gel up. Two winters ago I had this problem with my 2017 Ford F-250. The truck would run but gave me low fuel pressure and reduced power messages before finally shutting off.

I had to replace both fuel filters (about $100) and thaw out my truck. Eventually, the fuel station reimbursed me for three full tanks of fuel and the cost of the fuel filters (very impressed). But it was about -20F as well.

Thanks to both of you guys. I live in NE Massachusetts, right near the NH border. So while it gets cold here it's not usually insanely cold, nor for extended stretches of time. Much below zero F does happen on occasion, but
is the exception rather than the rule.

I don't see myself going through a lot of fuel in a winter, so the cost of additives is not a huge factor for me. On the other hand, the fuel I do keep on hand (what's in the tractor and a single 5 gallon can) will tend to be sitting around a fair bit out in the cold before I go through it. Is it "cheap insurance" to add such stuff? what's recommended for this sort of situation?

Thanks again. lots to learn...

RCW · Nov 4, 2019

North Idaho Wolfman said:
No not typically, you need to treat the fuel.

Couple winters ago, saw a friend trying to fill his truck at the local fuel company's station. Place sells a lot of diesel.

It was cold...Fuel was gelled at the pump.

Yeah, like Wolfman and Trover said, use an additive.

troverman · Nov 4, 2019

AL A said:
Thanks to both of you guys. I live in NE Massachusetts, right near the NH border. So while it gets cold here it's not usually insanely cold, nor for extended stretches of time. Much below zero F does happen on occasion, but
is the exception rather than the rule.

I don't see myself going through a lot of fuel in a winter, so the cost of additives is not a huge factor for me. On the other hand, the fuel I do keep on hand (what's in the tractor and a single 5 gallon can) will tend to be sitting around a fair bit out in the cold before I go through it. Is it "cheap insurance" to add such stuff? what's recommended for this sort of situation?

Thanks again. lots to learn...

A 5 gallon can filled with diesel will be fine through the winter. It might be a good idea to get one bottle of diesel anti-gel and mix in the correct amount. Don't buy Diesel 911 (use that if you are already gelled) but Power Service does offer a good anti-gel / lube boost in the silver containers.

When I had a Ford diesel, I stocked up on Ford Motorcraft PM-22 / 23. PM-22 is a lubricity boost and a cetane boost. PM-23 is anti-gel and lubricity boost. You can buy it at any Ford dealership. I've run it in my Kubotas each winter; I now run it in my RAM Cummins truck. I think it's about $12 to treat 125 gallons.

Bmyers · Nov 5, 2019

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=n8gDN_6esfs

The above link is to a video testing some different diesel additives.

AL A · Nov 5, 2019

Thanks all. Some good advice. I suppose I need to pick up some appropriate additive before any really cold weather arrives here. Thanks for all of the input. Thanks for the link to the PF video, pretty interesting.

sheepfarmer · Nov 5, 2019

AL A said:
Sorry if this is a dumb question, but I've never owned a diesel vehicle of any sort before. Does diesel fuel sold at the pump for over the road vehicles typically have the anti-gel additives and other such stuff?

Not a dumb question, it depends on when and where you buy the diesel. The "winter diesel" should be coming to the stations around here soon, maybe not soon enough since we have unusually cold weather on tap for the next couple of weeks. It doesn't necessarily have the anti gel additives like we buy and add ourselves, but it is a mixture of No 1 and No 2 diesels which gels at a much lower temp than "summer" diesel.

If your tractor is full of summer diesel and you expect cold weather it is a good idea to add anti gel additives.

dlundblad · Nov 7, 2019

I had my tractor out in -15*F weather last winter and believe it or not, the fuel was starting to crystal up when the engine was cold. The fuel almost looked like a pinkish apple sauce vs a liquid.

The tractor ran fine and the fuel thawed in about 30 minutes of running the tractor, but this is probably something I would try to avoid. I assumed the fuel was treated, but apparently not.

Keeping Bessie II Warm

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