Oil Issue

JMO · Jan 9, 2019

Did something stupid and looking for advice help.

I selected two gallon jugs instead of 1 gallon jugs of motor oil and added the entire 2 gallons of oil to my Kubota MX4700DT. Thinking I had 8 quarts from the gallon jugs I ended up with 16 quarts.

Tractor started normal, all of a sudden it coughed black smoke everywhere and engine died. Once I realized what I had done, I removed the excess oil and tried to start the tractor. No go. Starter engaged, but engine will not turn.

Any ideas would be helpful.

Thanks

North Idaho Wolfman · Jan 9, 2019

JMO said:
Did something stupid and looking for advice help.

I selected two gallon jugs instead of 1 gallon jugs of motor oil and added the entire 2 gallons of oil to my Kubota MX4700DT. Thinking I had 8 quarts from the gallon jugs I ended up with 16 quarts.

Tractor started normal, all of a sudden it coughed black smoke everywhere and engine died. Once I realized what I had done, I removed the excess oil and tried to start the tractor. No go. Starter engaged, but engine will not turn.

Any ideas would be helpful.

Thanks

I take it you didn't pull the dipstick and check it before you ran it.

You need to pull the injectors or glow plugs and see if motor will turn.
Sounds like you might have broken or bent something internally.
If it doesn't your looking at a rebuild.

hagrid · Jan 9, 2019

Oh my. Could be hydro lock via the crank case recirculator.

SidecarFlip · Jan 9, 2019

hagrid said:
Oh my. Could be hydro lock via the crank case recirculator.

I have to ask, what is that???

BruceP · Jan 9, 2019

If starter turns over the engine, then it is not hydro-locked.

You may need to remove the glowplugs then turn over the engine to 'blow out' any excess oil from the cylinders.

SidecarFlip · Jan 9, 2019

BruceP said:
If starter turns over the engine, then it is not hydro-locked.

You may need to remove the glowplugs then turn over the engine to 'blow out' any excess oil from the cylinders.

Post 1......"Starter engaged, but engine will not turn." I'd say it's locked up.

What I want to know is 1: What is the crank case recirculator and two, how does too much oil hydrolock an engine. Never did that but then I look at what I put in and have for decades.

I'm sure Obe Wan Kubota will have the skinny on both.

North Idaho Wolfman · Jan 9, 2019

Crank Case recirculator = Crank Case vent, which on newer models is connected to the intake to recirculate and burn off blow by.

If engine is overfilled with oil it can push oil into the intake and hydro lock the motor with oil.

And most of the time when an engine hydro locks on oil it will either break the pistons or bend the rods or both!

SidecarFlip · Jan 9, 2019

North Idaho Wolfman said:
Crank Case recirculator = Crank Case vent, which on newer models is connected to the intake to recirculate and burn off blow by.

If engine is overfilled with oil it can push oil into the intake and hydro lock the motor with oil.

And most of the time when an engine hydro locks on oil it will either break the pistons or bend the rods or both!

Something I don't have so I had no idea what it was. I have a draft tube (old school) but nothing ever comes out of it so I must not have any or much blow by.

Sort of like a PCV valve on a car motor???

85Hokie · Jan 10, 2019

SidecarFlip said:
Something I don't have so I had no idea what it was. I have a draft tube (old school) but nothing ever comes out of it so I must not have any or much blow by.

Sort of like a PCV valve on a car motor???

You got it!

PCV ....positive crankcase ventilation.......I have a B7100 that, well likes to breathe a little smoky-smoky out the ol tube.

As wolfman pointed out, the machine has gone from a vapor squeezer to a hydraulic cylinder, and there is NO place to push the fluid! (OIL)

As said - and have seen this many times on a top gas tanked tractor with the leaky float.......fuel fills the cylinder and boom! Bent stuff......take glows out or pull all the injectors, cross fingers and rotate engine.......stand back if/when you do it - IF the engine turns .....all that excess oil will come out in nice big squirts!!!

Report back your findings.

SidecarFlip · Jan 10, 2019

Now I understand. The term was not familiar to me. I can see where acute over filling of the crankcase could result in a very expensive mistake.

Not sure how anyone could overfill to 2 times the required fill but poop happens I guess.

In all my years, never made that mistake and I do my own oil and filter changes on all my engines.

Sounds very expensive to rectify.

Glad I'm all pre-Tier 4.

D2Cat · Jan 10, 2019

JMO said, "...and added the entire 2 gallons of oil to my Kubota MX4700DT." Isn't that 8 quarts? I need Skeets with his slide-rule!

skeets · Jan 10, 2019

Well yeah unless your doing metric then its only 7.57082357 liters.

Wait,,,

it only has an 8.5 quart capacity for the motor.... I shudder to think what the inside looks like

SidecarFlip · Jan 10, 2019

D2Cat said:
JMO said, "...and added the entire 2 gallons of oil to my Kubota MX4700DT." Isn't that 8 quarts? I need Skeets with his slide-rule!

He stated....

"I selected two gallon jugs instead of 1 gallon jugs of motor oil and added the entire 2 gallons of oil to my Kubota MX4700DT. Thinking I had 8 quarts from the gallon jugs I ended up with 16 quarts."

2 jugs at 2 gallons each, not one. Now if it was me, even in my feeble condition, I can tell the difference (in physical weight) of a 2 gallon jug of oil versus a 1 gallon jug.

Could have been one of those 'ooooops' moments.

85Hokie · Jan 10, 2019

SidecarFlip said:
Now I understand. The term was not familiar to me. I can see where acute over filling of the crankcase could result in a very expensive mistake.

Not sure how anyone could overfill to 2 times the required fill but poop happens I guess.

In all my years, never made that mistake and I do my own oil and filter changes on all my engines.

Sounds very expensive to rectify.

Glad I'm all pre-Tier 4.

In college - my roommate......we were changing his oil in his camaro.....everything was fine until I asked the 3rd time....."you got the plug back in?" - YES I do ........as the first quart was poured .....and traveled to the parking lot.....the second quart was still pouring.....

sharp as a bowling ball!

SidecarFlip · Jan 10, 2019

85Hokie said:
In college - my roommate......we were changing his oil in his camaro.....everything was fine until I asked the 3rd time....."you got the plug back in?" - YES I do ........as the first quart was poured .....and traveled to the parking lot.....the second quart was still pouring.....

sharp as a bowling ball!

Happened at the Western Star dealership I retired from. A tech was changing the oil in a Class 8 and forgot to tighten the drain plug. The customer drove off and toasted the motor from lack of lube oil. Cost the dealership the price of a new Caterpillar 3406 engine. Cost the tech his job.

Things happen, Just don't want it happening to me (if I can avoid it).

Did the front brakes on the wife's buggy and forgot to torque the caliper hold down bolts. Paid a tow bill and dealt with an angry wife for a month plus a new rotor, pads and dust shield.... and a new bolt too.

D2Cat · Jan 10, 2019

Hey guys, I've forgot a drain plug at lease once!!

That wasn't near as bad as letting the ROPS hit a tree limb!

I've made a couple of other goofs before also.

I did put a 6' wide door in a 16' concrete block silo and it didn't fall in. So I do some things right!

sheepfarmer · Jan 10, 2019

85Hokie said:
You got it!

PCV ....positive crankcase ventilation.......I have a B7100 that, well likes to breathe a little smoky-smoky out the ol tube.

As wolfman pointed out, the machine has gone from a vapor squeezer to a hydraulic cylinder, and there is NO place to push the fluid! (OIL)

As said - and have seen this many times on a top gas tanked tractor with the leaky float.......fuel fills the cylinder and boom! Bent stuff......take glows out or pull all the injectors, cross fingers and rotate engine.......stand back if/when you do it - IF the engine turns .....all that excess oil will come out in nice big squirts!!!

Report back your findings.

Ok so in this case HOW do you turn the engine in actual practice? Someplace by hand or by trying to get the battery to crank it? I know probably a dumb question but I'm curious.

85Hokie · Jan 10, 2019

sheepfarmer said:
Ok so in this case HOW do you turn the engine in actual practice? Someplace by hand or by trying to get the battery to crank it? I know probably a dumb question but I'm curious.

I would say by hand......really hard to make it worse by hand.....

hitting the switch will be either oil squirting out....or a buzz...or both!

If damage is done - spinning it can make it worse via the key, but by hand, the hand will tell if it cannot move

SidecarFlip · Jan 10, 2019

D2Cat said:
Hey guys, I've forgot a drain plug at lease once!!

That wasn't near as bad as letting the ROPS hit a tree limb!

I've made a couple of other goofs before also.

I did put a 6' wide door in a 16' concrete block silo and it didn't fall in. So I do some things right!

Works on gavel. Not so good on concrete......

sheepfarmer · Jan 10, 2019

85Hokie said:
I would say by hand......really hard to make it worse by hand.....

hitting the switch will be either oil squirting out....or a buzz...or both!

If damage is done - spinning it can make it worse via the key, but by hand, the hand will tell if it cannot move

I am imagining what I could conveniently access on my tractor that has to do with the crankshaft and the only thing I can come up with is the fan belt, would that work?

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