PTO switch reversed on M5140

Tallahassee Kubota Man · Aug 30, 2014

Took delivery last week on a new M5140. Love the tractor....perfect size and power for my needs. There is one issue though. The PTO switch engages my mower just fine, but it works in reverse of what it should. I questioned the salesman and he said he thought there were 2 wires that somehow got reversed. He's checking with his mechanics, but haven't gotten an answer yet. I don't see how the wires could be reversed, seems to me the design should prevent that from happening during assembly. To me it's more likely that the PTO switch itself needs to be taken loose from it's bracket and reversed. Ever hear of this?
Mark

85Hokie · Aug 30, 2014

Tallahassee Kubota Man said:
Took delivery last week on a new M5140. Love the tractor....perfect size and power for my needs. There is one issue though. The PTO switch engages my mower just fine, but it works in reverse of what it should. I questioned the salesman and he said he thought there were 2 wires that somehow got reversed. He's checking with his mechanics, but haven't gotten an answer yet. I don't see how the wires could be reversed, seems to me the design should prevent that from happening during assembly. To me it's more likely that the PTO switch itself needs to be taken loose from it's bracket and reversed. Ever hear of this?
Mark

I am not familiar with that Kubota, but is it a pull switch or a lever? Either way there has to be a closing contact system in place, a simple open/closed switch.....I do NOT think that the wires are backwards, because you are simply closing the loop. MAYBE the switch has been replaced with a NORMALLY CLOSED SWITCH and you need a NORMALLY OPEN SWITCH.
Some safety switches are normally open, and then you sit on the seat and the contacts close, others are closed then whatever you do it is open.....a lawnmower cutting in reverse is a type of switch like that, normal open, then you throw it in rev and it closes the contacts and the mower dies......

just a thought..........

North Idaho Wolfman · Aug 30, 2014

Actually have heard of both situations happening on switch installs, and either change will fix your problem.

Tallahassee Kubota Man · Aug 30, 2014

85Hokie, it is a lever that engages the pto and is an independent pto that requires no clutching. It's a new tractor so guessing the factory did this. I can't believe it wasn't tested before it left the factory.

North Idaho Wolfman · Aug 30, 2014

Something does not set right, you do not have a electrically controlled PTO, you have a cable controlled PTO, so no swapping wires.
What exact model is it, there are different control setups per model.

85Hokie · Aug 30, 2014

North Idaho Wolfman said:
Something does not set right, you do not have a electrically controlled PTO, you have a cable controlled PTO, so no swapping wires.
What exact model is it, there are different control setups per model.

Wolfman,

looking it up .....what the hell is a Hydraulic
Self-Modulating engagement ?

https://www.kubota.com/assets/product/comps/M5140/m40 comp.pdf

sounds if more than a simple problem!

North Idaho Wolfman · Aug 30, 2014

85Hokie said:
Wolfman, looking it up .....what the hell is a Hydraulic Self-Modulating engagement ?

A mode of automatic control in which the action of the final control element is proportional to the deviation, from set point, of the controlled medium.

Simply put, automatic hydraulic control.

85Hokie · Aug 31, 2014

North Idaho Wolfman said:
A mode of automatic control in which the action of the final control element is proportional to the deviation, from set point, of the controlled medium.
Simply put, automatic hydraulic control.

Dayum, had to read it three times before I knew that I could NOT understand it.....

- why in the hell doesnt Kubota just say......

Hydraulic controlled .......

- and thank you!

Tallahassee Kubota Man · Sep 1, 2014

North Idaho Wolfman, the model # is M5140 HD....hydraulic shuttle shift w/4wd. If I understand right the switch (lever) is connected to a cable which in turn physically moves the pto hydraulic control unit. So, the answer to my problem seems to be that the switch/lever needs to be taken loose from it's bracket and reversed. Will try to follow the length of the cable later to see where it goes.
Thanks all for the comments, have a great Labor Day.

North Idaho Wolfman · Sep 1, 2014

Yep you got it.
Here is what your looking at:

Tallahassee Kubota Man · Sep 2, 2014

Thanks, the diagram is a huge help.

85Hokie · Sep 2, 2014

North Idaho Wolfman said:
Yep you got it.
Here is what your looking at:

Something still is not right......

D268xx needs to move either cw or ccw......which way is it in the picture?
Is it engaged or not? pulling on the cable takes a linear motion and converts it into rotary motion, so either the cw/ccw is backwards ....or?

looking at the picture - looking at the safety switch - is it engaged or disengaged as the pto is placed into motion?

so my question - how could it be backwards? unless the cable is routed to pull rather than push ?????

Tallahassee Kubota Man · Sep 2, 2014

Which side of the tractor are we looking from? I'm assuming the left side is the front and the right the rear of the tractor.

85Hokie · Sep 2, 2014

Tallahassee Kubota Man said:
Which side of the tractor are we looking from? I'm assuming the left side is the front and the right the rear of the tractor.

ON this tractor......what hand is used to throw the lever? Left or right?

North Idaho Wolfman · Sep 2, 2014

Tallahassee Kubota Man said:
Which side of the tractor are we looking from? I'm assuming the left side is the front and the right the rear of the tractor.

Yes you are right. that would be the left side of the tractor.

Tallahassee Kubota Man · Sep 2, 2014

85Hokie, the lever in engaged by the right hand.

85Hokie · Sep 2, 2014

tallahassee kubota man said:
85hokie, the lever in engaged by the right hand.

on part 030 (two slots) --where is the on position - forward or back? Towards the switch or away from the switch?

North Idaho Wolfman · Sep 2, 2014

85Hokie said:
on part 030 (two slots) --where is the on position - forward or back? Towards the switch or away from the switch?

85Hokie,
If I'm thinking what your thinking, the electrical switch is not what engages the PTO, it's just a safety for the starter circuit, so swapping it around wouldn't solve the problem.

I'm thinking the valve on the side of the transmission is flipped to the top side and that's why it's working backwards.

85Hokie · Sep 2, 2014

North Idaho Wolfman said:
85Hokie,
If I'm thinking what your thinking, the electrical switch is not what engages the PTO, it's just a safety for the starter circuit, so swapping it around wouldn't solve the problem.

I'm thinking the valve on the side of the transmission is flipped to the top side and that's why it's working backwards.

now, I think that IS THE solution

..........that would solve this riddle !!

good job - you de man with the plan ! hope that is the solution......

Tallahassee Kubota Man · Sep 2, 2014

Hey you guys, I appreciate your comments. I checked to see what my tractor has compared to the diagram. The lever cover (030) and the lever assembly (040, etc.) is mounted (on the fender) 180 degrees from the diagram. Looks like quite a job to reverse it.

PTO switch reversed on M5140

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