Cheaper Bolt on hook option for BX tractors?

tiktock · Sep 7, 2018

I keep thinking...my FEL can only lift ~750 and curl in the ~1250 range...why do I need big beefy bolt on hooks at a price of ~$40-50 each just to add a hook that can handle a half ton lifting capacity?

I am shocked there are not options for less beefy hooks available at cheaper prices. We're talking basic hardware here so I must be missing something.

Wouldnt two 1" washers and almost any hook that could be drilled through on the market work to lift less than 1500 pounds?

Is this simply a supply vs demand issue as to why people are able to charge upwards of $100 in some cases for a drop forged hook welded to a 2" plate with some bolts? To give an equal example, many vendors sell boltable 2" receiver hitches for the BX series in the $100 range but can be made for less than $25 by using an ATV bumper receiver and drilling two holes....

Any cheaper DIY options out there than the commercial offerings from kens or BXepanded?

chim · Sep 7, 2018

My brother-in-law has some of Ken's hardware and the quality is excellent. It is worth the money for someone who wants something robust that they can simply bolt on. I'd be willing to bet if lighter / cheaper bolt-on hooks were available, some nimrod would buy them and bolt them on an M series and badmouth the manufacturer when they failed.

85Hokie · Sep 7, 2018

Not to be an azz......but the devils advocate......

What would happen if that "inexpensive" hook failed ? And that "item" were to come crashing down?

If you have any welder friends......get them to make a pair, a 24 pack of beer should cover it ......depending on the quality of your friendship!

bcp · Sep 7, 2018

https://www.harborfreight.com/10000-lb-capacity-tow-hook-kit-67497.html

or

https://www.harborfreight.com/12-in-forged-cargo-d-ring-anchor-60323.html

Bruce

Redlands · Sep 7, 2018

http://www.boltonhooks.com/bolt-on.html

25 dollars each plus shipping it looks like. Quite a bit under the $100 range. Kens products seem to have a good reputation. Do you really want to by the cheapest product you can find to lift items ? One hook breaks and you tweak the front end loader or tip the tractor over or ruin what your moving, are just a couple issues.

Hard to realize sometimes that your dealing with possible life and safety issues. Probably why the equipment does not come from the factory with the items. In fact some literature indicates warranties are voided if used.

tiktock · Sep 7, 2018

85Hokie said:
Not to be an azz......but the devils advocate......

What would happen if that "inexpensive" hook failed ? And that "item" were to come crashing down?

If you have any welder friends......get them to make a pair, a 24 pack of beer should cover it ......depending on the quality of your friendship!

That would be my responsibility...no different than anyone who buys these bolt on hooks from what I can tell.

tiktock · Sep 7, 2018

Redlands said:
http://www.boltonhooks.com/bolt-on.html

25 dollars each plus shipping it looks like. Quite a bit under the $100 range. Kens products seem to have a good reputation. Do you really want to by the cheapest product you can find to lift items ? One hook breaks and you tweak the front end loader or tip the tractor over or ruin what your moving, are just a couple issues.

Hard to realize sometimes that your dealing with possible life and safety issues.

I'm quite sure with my SSQA BX1880 bucket I need the option that turns each hook into more like a 40-$55 each bolt purchase since I'd need the spacers and such. 80-$110 seems outrageous.

I'm not really looking to risk safety here...I'm just saying I dont need a hook system with a #4500 breaking force when my bucket at its extent really cant lift much above 600 with the bolts.

I can appreciate that from a maker standpoint, it makes zero sense for them to fabricate a lesser bolt for me vs making a bolt for the largest application and expecting all to utilize it.

All I was saying with my post was it seems a bit weird having to pay double the cost of my log chains and towing chains for hooks alone to attach them to. If a 20 foot Grade 70 chain with two hooks is like $30...why is a single hook welded to a 2" plate with bolts more expensive?

tiktock · Sep 7, 2018

bcp said:
https://www.harborfreight.com/10000-lb-capacity-tow-hook-kit-67497.html

or

https://www.harborfreight.com/12-in-forged-cargo-d-ring-anchor-60323.html

Bruce

The first hook I've seen people using on their buckets. Seems to me two big washers and its really no functionally different than the more expensive options?

Ramos · Sep 7, 2018

We are two peas in a pod, tiktock! No way would I ever drop that much money on two hooks. Highway robbery, for sure.

Here's what I did: I spent $8.00 apiece for two hooks that are actually designed to be welded and accept either 3/8" or 1/2" chain. Scrounge up spacer stock and flat plate from your scrap pile (zero cost) and all you need is two or three bucks worth of hardware. Bada-bing, done for less than 20 dollars!

The only expenses not mentioned for this project are roughly, as follows:
Shop: $5-50K
Welder: $1-2.5K
Cutting Tools: $500 (I'm cheap)
Drill Press: $500
Experience: Priceless
Paint: $7.50
Electricity: Varies by location.

The above is offered in jest! I do have a point to make though. Lifting and pulling is not an area to be cheap. A safety factor of 150% should be bare bones minimum.

SRG · Sep 7, 2018

Bad things happen when rigging fails. Bad bad things happen FAST when rigging is undersized.
There is a safety factor built in, to over sizing your rigging.
Your bucket can lift 600#. Great. The forces are multiplied when you add in sudden starting and stopping , like when trying to yank a post out of the ground.

It's always "that one time", when you need the heavier riggin, but didn't have it.

RCW · Sep 7, 2018

Ticktock -

You asked for a less expensive hook, not a good less expensive hook.

I would go for the $6 tow hooks from HF.

That cheap Chinese cast could be prone to break without warning. In a tow mode, just a problem.

In a lift mode...WHOLE different connotation. I wouldn't be surprised that somewhere in the small print the specs for them says not for lifting.

Also, you may have figured out your BX has a vulnerable HST cooling fan under the seat. A $12 part takes a lot to replace. There are aftermarket under-guards to protect it....but I think they cost more than $100 too...

The 200 hour service takes replacement of hydraulic fluid/filter, motor oil/filter, and draining front axle and replacing with hydraulic fluid. SUDT2 is pretty expensive...get the cheap shit from TSC for $40. You may not have to worry about another change, because it might not last that long... I'm not even going to get into the 50 hour service....

I paid good money for my tractor. I choose to pay good (Read: wise) money to operate and maintain it. However, only I can determine what that is.

It's your tractor. Do with yours as you wish. Like me, only you can determine what is appropriate today, and the consequences those decisions may represent tomorrow, or 5 years from now.

tiktock · Sep 7, 2018

I am feeling the group vibe here is kinda on the "dont be a cheapskate" sense and I can appreciate that. Perhaps I should just pay the price of what appears to be the only option on the market...I just thought it was worth a quick question.

Perhaps what I'm seeing is a simple business opportunity. Maybe its impossible to find a company that would fab these things up in bulk cheaper than we're finding them but I seriously find that hard to believe...I might be way off.

I saw someone on here commended for using angle iron with slots for chains vs buying hooks....I imagine that option is like asking for cancer compared the the options I was thinking about here using less expensive towing hooks and such.

I dont really think its a fair comparison to changing fluids inside the engine with non-recommended fluids to not using hooks from the one guy who just happens to be selling them specifically for these machines with no competition.

I'm a custom knifemaker and there used to be a certain vendors for a specialized tool used in making slipjoint folding knives...crazy prices but no other options. A few of us got together, struck a deal with a local waterjet company and produced enough to get one to every knifemaker we knew for 1/10 the cost....sometimes its just taking the time to ask the question.

John T · Sep 7, 2018

tiktock said:
Is this simply a supply vs demand issue as to why people are able to charge upwards of $100 in some cases for a drop forged hook welded to a 2" plate with some bolts?.

Well kinda...

The "demand" is from folks that have no ability to fabricate on their own...

Not a knock to anyone, Just a fact.

If I were you, I would buy a couple 3/8 hooks or whatever size you want...
visit the local welder and have him weld them to a piece of flat stock. then bolt em on.

shouldn't be more than 20-25 bucks.

If you were nearby me, I'd do it for free. I do accept liquid tips though..

RCW · Sep 7, 2018

tiktock said:
I am feeling the group vibe here is kinda on the "dont be a cheapskate" sense and I can appreciate that.

Ticktock - as a knifemaker, you know cost does not always equate to quality.

I was not trying to say pay more because it's better.....Trust me, I don't operate that way.

In the end, we all want something to perform it's intended purpose for a long period of time. That applies to hooks, oils and fluids, filters, HST fans, etc.....

Here on OTT, we hear SUDT2 is pricey, this part is pricey. Or....I was a bonehead and used incompatible hydraulic fluid (because it was cheaper), and now I have a BIG problem...

I have the ability to make Kenny's hooks. I don't have the materials or time to do so. To take a project on to do 3 (my preference - 2 grabs near each lift arm and slip in the middle), I would have much more into it than Kenny's price all done at my door. That assumes my time costs something, which it certainly does.

You do as you chose. While I may have been a little harsh, my point was do your stuff with quality.

Cost is always a consideration for me too, but not the only consideration.....

Best wishes!

D2Cat · Sep 7, 2018

Tiktock, your a skilled craftsman by your own description. You came with a question and got various answers explaining risk, dangers, cost and liability.

Ramos mentioned it. Find hooks that suit you, fabricate them the way you want them. Bolt or weld them to your bucket just as you want them. You can find them at your local farm store or Amazon, Ebay, and you have options to size, cost, mounting, color, etc.

I personally bought hooks off of Ebay for like $20 a pair and welded them to my loader bucket.

I am absolutely not concerned about liability of a failed hook by my welding it on.

If one lets liability concerns control everything they do you better close up shop and get rid of welders, grinders, air compressors, plasma cutters, drills, face shield, welding hoods, and on and on.

Nope, just use the same judgement you use in every other function of your life!

tiktock · Sep 7, 2018

D2Cat said:
Tiktock, your a skilled craftsman by your own description. You came with a question and got various answers explaining risk, dangers, cost and liability.

Ramos mentioned it. Find hooks that suit you, fabricate them the way you want them. Bolt or weld them to your bucket just as you want them. You can find them at your local farm store or Amazon, Ebay, and you have options to size, cost, mounting, color, etc.

I personally bought hooks off of Ebay for like $20 a pair and welded them to my loader bucket.

I am absolutely not concerned about liability of a failed hook by my welding it on.

If one lets liability concerns control everything they do you better close up shop and get rid of welders, grinders, air compressors, plasma cutters, drills, face shield, welding hoods, and on and on.

Nope, just use the same judgement you use in every other function of your life!

Agreed. My apologies if I didnt appear to appreciate the advice. I probably worded my original post wrongly.

You are right that I do a lot of fabrication in my knifemaking. My shop is filled with lathes, milling machines, heat treating ovens and such...thats honestly why I asked the question since I can't equate the cost to the labor in this case and I am still assuming I'm missing something.

Convenience has a price and I can absolutely appreciate that. Obviously businesses in the convenience industry who price correctly walk that fine line to maximize profits. Back when I was into knifemaking more seriously, a long timer told me that if 25% of my customers weren't rejecting my product due to cost, I was under-valuing my work and he was right because at the time my backlog was growing but not my prices.

If my bucket allowed for a cheaper bolt on option, I'd be going for it. The smaller SSQA buckets require the adaptors and push the price outside what I think they are worth so I'll probably just fabricate my own and have someone weld em on.

Fro65 · Sep 7, 2018

For me, it ultimately boiled down to what my time is worth. I decided to buy (yes, from ken) as opposed to fabricating my own. By doing so, I got way better quality than I would have if I made them myself and my time was better spent on other things. The way I see it, I came out money ahead by buying.

Just my two cents.

Creature Meadow · Sep 8, 2018

Here is what I did, found 4 hooks in the barn, scavenged up some flat stock, bought some paint and a 24 pack of Natural Light.

Talked to a friend who welds and he said I'll be glad to weld them for you.

He welded them to the plates for me and I bead blasted and drilled additional holes, two already in the stock.

Primed painted and bolted to my bucket.

Cost be bout $15.00 since I had the materials, only cost the suds.

bherron1 · Sep 8, 2018

The first hook shown from HF is rated at 10,000 lbs so it will for sure hold 5000 two of those are going on my bucket. A lot of items I see are way over rated, just use common since when lifting and stay safe.

Kennyd4110 · Sep 8, 2018

bherron1 said:
The first hook shown from HF is rated at 10,000 lbs so it will for sure hold 5000 two of those are going on my bucket. A lot of items I see are way over rated, just use common since when lifting and stay safe.

A customer with a 30hp New Holland sent me these pictures when he bought our hooks.

Yes, you get what you pay for-even if you think you think your a victim of "highway robbery" (comment not directed at you).

Cheaper Bolt on hook option for BX tractors?

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