LED tail/turn lights L3700SU or L3800

Burt

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Mar 24, 2012
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Greetings!

Have any of you replaced their turn/flasher signals on the rear fenders with LED's? IF so, does the flasher work properly? By that, I mean, hyperflash or get stuck? LED's as you know require less amperage. A typical incandescent will draw about 1 amp and and LED about half that amperage.

A standard non flashing LED would likely be OK but the flasher unit itself may need to be changed out in order for LED's to work properly.

Since Kubota doesn't offer replacement bulbs in a standard base nor LED bulb replacements, I'm thinking of replacing the entire stud mount turn flasher housing with an LED double face from Superbrightleds.com.

I don't think Kubota will want to deal with this as it a bit off the bell curve of standard questions or issues.

Thanks for any answers.

Burt
 

North Idaho Wolfman

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I tried a set of LED bulbs on my L3450 and it acted very weird would work some times wouldn't work other times. I'm not sure if it's a bulb problem or a flasher problem, been to cold to work on it for a while.
You might have better luck changing out the whole fixture.
 

Burt

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I tried a set of LED bulbs on my L3450 and it acted very weird would work some times wouldn't work other times. I'm not sure if it's a bulb problem or a flasher problem, been to cold to work on it for a while.
You might have better luck changing out the whole fixture.
Thanks,

I was going to do that but prior to buying and installing them, I knew enough about LED milliamperes requirements and thought better of it. I'm just guessing your issue had to do with amperage also.

One needs to knockdown the amperage on the LED's or they won't work right usually, especially flashers as they get a higher starting amperage when they activate. pays to know OHM's law. The amp draw from super right led's is 590ma and a standard incandescent LED in an1156 or 1157 configuration draws 1 amp. That will need to be reduced or it will damage the LED or perhaps make it act weird. I could put in a knockdown resistor into the circuit but thought someone else had already invented this wheel.

Maybe some others have changed out the whole fixture.

I am surprised though that Kubota does not offer LED stop/tail lights!

Burt
 

North Idaho Wolfman

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I'm also surprised that they haven't switched to LED head lights too! They're are so many advantages to those over standard bulbs.

I think, but not sure, my problem with the LED's for tail lights and flashers is that I'm not getting good connections to the base of the LED's (they are just a set of cheap one for testing).
I also think by looking at the flasher and schematic, the point should be moot because I do believe the flasher is solid state (timed) and not amperage (thermal) based, that is just an observation at this point because it had a ground lead and most if not all thermal flasher do not require a ground.
 

Dan_R_42

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B7100-D, w/ Sims Cab, B219 FEL, ARPS 70 Backhoe, Oversized R4 Tires, LX2610 Cab
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Here is a link for the flasher units you may want to check out. If the LED's are setup for 12 volts you don't need to worry about the current. They are internally wired with resistors for proper 12 volt operation. You do not want to add additional resistors to those lights. Just wire them up to the 12 volt circuit, and add the correct flasher or controller to get your desired result.

http://www.superbrightleds.com/search/led-products/led flasher/

If you really want to get fancy check out this LED controller. There is a great video demo if you look under the Photo/Video tab. It shows all the strobe patterns available

http://www.superbrightleds.com/more...d-multi-function-strobe-controller/1105/2620/

Of the 10 light patterns on this controller, I would use 4 or 5 of them.
 
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Burt

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L3700SU, box blade, 6 foot rhino blade, 1 bottom plow, 3 point receiver hitch.
Mar 24, 2012
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Goldendale, WA USA
Here is a link for the flasher units you may want to check out. If the LED's are setup for 12 volts you don't need to worry about the current. They are internally wired with resistors for proper 12 volt operation. You do not want to add additional resistors to those lights. Just wire them up to the 12 volt circuit, and add the correct flasher or controller to get your desired result.

http://www.superbrightleds.com/search/led-products/led flasher/

If you really want to get fancy check out this LED controller. There is a great video demo if you look under the Photo/Video tab. It shows all the strobe patterns available

http://www.superbrightleds.com/more...d-multi-function-strobe-controller/1105/2620/

Of the 10 light patterns on this controller, I would use 4 or 5 of them.
Thank you for the info. I'LL get the whole unit and plug it in. I'm sure with you on Kubota'S lack of foresight on LED's.

Burt
 

Burt

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NIW,

Follow up on the LED's... Dealer tells me there is a flasher in these units. A flasher unless it has reduced amperage will destroy, deflect or otherwise an LED light fixture or bulb. Unfortunately, unless one wants to change out the flasher AND the fixture, we are stuck with incandescent turn and flashers. That will wipe out any advantage at this point.

Stuck.

Burt
 

chim

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Your dealer needs to take some electrical classes. Unless there's some magical way the flasher can transform the 12V from the battery into something of a much greater magnitude, there is no way it can hurt the LED lamp. The LED lamps typically operate within a range of 10-30V. As a side note, unlike incandescents LED's dont give one hoot about how many times they are turned off and on.

The current that passes through an LED lamp is determined by the lamp itself and voltage applied to it. If you remove a large incandescent (possibly a headlight) that draws 5 amps and replace it with an LED that is advertised as drawing 590mA, the LED will draw 590mA. What the lamp that was previously there drew means nothing with respect to the current the LED draws. According to his theory, it would mean that if you unplugged a toaster that draws 8 amps and plugged in a night light that draws 0.5A (500mA) the night light would blow up.

Resistors are sometimes added to flasher circuits where LED's replaced incan's because the low current draw of the LED's isn't high enough to make SOME flashers operate. The resistors are put in parallel with the lamp to increase current in the circuit and convince the flasher that there's enough load to operate. EDIT TO ADD: Note that I said the current is increased in the CIRCUIT and not the lamp. In a perfect situation, if the flasher needs to see 1A to function, the resistor would be sized to pass 410mA if the lamp passed 590mA. At 12V that would be roughly a 30 ohm resistor.

Please don't be taking any electrical advice from that guy.
 
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North Idaho Wolfman

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I'm with chim on his statement!

Burt,
I know there is a flasher in there otherwise the lights wouldn't blink.;)
Give me a couple days for it to quit snowing and I'll hard wire up my LED bulbs as I think my problems were from bad sockets, and I'll test the flasher unit. I'm 99% sure it's a timer controlled flasher and not a thermal controlled because one light removed and they still flash at the same rate.
 

Dan_R_42

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Your dealer needs to take some electrical classes. Unless there's some magical way the flasher can transform the 12V from the battery into something of a much greater magnitude, there is no way it can hurt the LED lamp. The LED lamps typically operate within a range of 10-30V. As a side note, unlike incandescents LED's dont give one hoot about how many times they are turned off and on.

The current that passes through an LED lamp is determined by the lamp itself and voltage applied to it. If you remove a large incandescent (possibly a headlight) that draws 5 amps and replace it with an LED that is advertised as drawing 590mA, the LED will draw 590mA. What the lamp that was previously there drew means nothing with respect to the current the LED draws. According to his theory, it would mean that if you unplugged a toaster that draws 8 amps and plugged in a night light that draws 0.5A (500mA) the night light would blow up.

Resistors are sometimes added to flasher circuits where LED's replaced incan's because the low current draw of the LED's isn't high enough to make SOME flashers operate. The resistors are put in parallel with the lamp to increase current in the circuit and convince the flasher that there's enough load to operate. EDIT TO ADD: Note that I said the current is increased in the CIRCUIT and not the lamp. In a perfect situation, if the flasher needs to see 1A to function, the resistor would be sized to pass 410mA if the lamp passed 590mA. At 12V that would be roughly a 30 ohm resistor.

Please don't be taking any electrical advice from that guy.
Chim, I agree what you are trying to convey with your explanation, however, you don't want to be adding resistors to the circuit. The purpose to use LED's is to conserve current flow with these low power Dynamo's in the small tractors. By adding resistors to trick the flasher you are back to using up extra current (dissapated in heat) with the added resistors just to get the relay to work.

Just change out the Kubota factory flasher relay with the flasher units designed for the LED's. If the flasher needs a third wire ground then just swap out the relay socket too. (about $1.50 for socket)

http://www.superbrightleds.com/search/led-products/led flasher/


http://www.superbrightleds.com/more...f13gl-02-led-bulb-electronic-flasher/782/836/
 

chim

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Chim, I agree what you are trying to convey with your explanation, however, you don't want to be adding resistors to the circuit. The purpose to use LED's is to conserve current flow with these low power Dynamo's in the small tractors. By adding resistors to trick the flasher you are back to using up extra current (dissapated in heat) with the added resistors just to get the relay to work.

Just change out the Kubota factory flasher relay with the flasher units designed for the LED's. If the flasher needs a third wire ground then just swap out the relay socket too. (about $1.50 for socket)

http://www.superbrightleds.com/search/led-products/led flasher/


http://www.superbrightleds.com/more...f13gl-02-led-bulb-electronic-flasher/782/836/
You are absolutely correct. My intent was not to advise someone to add resistors, but rather explain WHY in some cases people have done so. The OP seemed to think that adding resistors was a requirement to lower the circuit's current when in fact people have been adding resistors to increase the current.
 

Burt

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Mar 24, 2012
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Goldendale, WA USA
Chim, I agree what you are trying to convey with your explanation, however, you don't want to be adding resistors to the circuit. The purpose to use LED's is to conserve current flow with these low power Dynamo's in the small tractors. By adding resistors to trick the flasher you are back to using up extra current (dissapated in heat) with the added resistors just to get the relay to work.

Just change out the Kubota factory flasher relay with the flasher units designed for the LED's. If the flasher needs a third wire ground then just swap out the relay socket too. (about $1.50 for socket)

http://www.superbrightleds.com/search/led-products/led flasher/


http://www.superbrightleds.com/more...f13gl-02-led-bulb-electronic-flasher/782/836/
Chim and Dan,

Yes, I agree with both of you and thank you for the follow ups. In order to do this, I'll need to get the pinout on the Kubota flasher first in order to select the correct one from superbrightleds. That is a trip to the dealer 40 miles away and the cost of the unit. Kubota's electrical diagrams don't list the pinouts. Then, the cost of the new flasher, the cost of the new fixtures, the under the dash knuckle bash. I'm now looking at this in a whole new light (pun) and not thinking it is a good idea.

This project is so far off the bell curve, it's going to have a tough time getting back on track for me.

Unlike a car or a truck, one can't just replace this turn/brake lights with aftermarket products. Kubota engineered this one in to assure original stuff I believe.

The other LED's added by others are not driven by flashers and thus are driven by a constant current and are successful. Plus, many of the aftermarket add on ights and bars are already protected internally.

If anybody does figure this one out, I'd sure like to know the part numbers and yadayadas.

Thanks again,

Burt
 

PrairieSoul

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B2920 BX2755HD LA364FL BH65
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I have a 2009 B2920. I replaced all of my bulbs with 1156 replacement LED's.
There is no problem, they work fine. I have not looked but if the part number for your flasher is the same as a B2920 you will not have a problem.

As said before, if you have a 12 volt system, LED's made for 12 volts will work, no need to limit current to them.
 

Burt

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L3700SU, box blade, 6 foot rhino blade, 1 bottom plow, 3 point receiver hitch.
Mar 24, 2012
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Goldendale, WA USA
I have a 2009 B2920. I replaced all of my bulbs with 1156 replacement LED's.
There is no problem, they work fine. I have not looked but if the part number for your flasher is the same as a B2920 you will not have a problem.

As said before, if you have a 12 volt system, LED's made for 12 volts will work, no need to limit current to them.
PrairieSoul,

Thanks for your experience reply on LED changeout. I'm still a bit reluctant to spend $100 for two tail/turn light fixures with LED's, wire them in and then find out they are a problem.

I'm also surprised that a standard 1156 fits into a Kubota. What I've observed is that the Kubota incandescent base is unique. Therefore, I sent pictures to SuperBrightLED's and they said they had NO replacement bulbs for that configuration. Perhaps Kubota changed their configuration recently to their engineered-in design.

Burt
 

North Idaho Wolfman

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Burt,
Post a picture of your bulbs for your lights, as mine are just ordinary 1157 bulbs.
The headlights are a unique design and have no standard replacement.
 

Burt

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L3700SU, box blade, 6 foot rhino blade, 1 bottom plow, 3 point receiver hitch.
Mar 24, 2012
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Goldendale, WA USA

North Idaho Wolfman

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That's the head light bulb, do your marker lights take that same bulb??? Mine don't on both the B7100 and the L3450, they either take an 1157 (dual element) or a 1156 (single element) depending on the fixture.
 

North Idaho Wolfman

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That is a 1157 Bulb, dual element, Think: marker light (dimmer element), turn, brake light (bright element)!

1156,1157,LED 2.jpg
 

Burt

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That is a 1157 Bulb, dual element, Think: marker light (dimmer element), turn, brake light (bright element)!

View attachment 9942
NIW,

You're right as usual! I guess I was distracted by Messick's bulbs not being labeled as to what they are. I totally missed the headlight bulb thinking it was Kubota's unusual design.

Now, I'll just order the bulbs instead of the whole graham cracker.

Thank you,

Burt