Kubota MX5200 HST cranks, but won't start

tor

Member
Jun 25, 2009
74
9
8
SC
Have an issue with my MX5200 (about 80 hours on it). I parked the tractor yesterday after cutting down some trees, bucking and loading the rounds in the FEL. Parked the tractor, and this morning it refuses to start. It turns, just wont start.

Took the filter out out of the water separator, cleaned the filter and cup, bled the system, and topped the tank off with fresh fuel. Checked all fuses for continuity. Checked safety switch under seat. Its not throwing any error codes.

Around 36 degrees yesterday when it started and ran fine. 41 today and no sign of life.

Any ideas, guys? This has me scratching my head.
 

Jim L.

Active member
Jun 18, 2014
811
86
28
Texas
Starter does crank engine. Fuel, air, compression.

Air intake clear?

Try jumpering another battery or vehicle to the tractor battery. Change crank speed? Tractor battery done in by cold or not getting charged?

All four ends of battery cables clean and tight?

Multi-grade engine oil for cold weather?
 

Russell King

Well-known member

Equipment
L185F, Modern Ag Competitor 4’ shredder, Rhino tiller, rear dirt scoop
Jun 17, 2012
4,603
975
113
Austin, Texas
Are you sure the fuel system is properly bled all the way to the injectors now? Just be sure you have it bled well.

Do you know for sure the glow plugs are working? Has it gotten colder than normal in the morning you had trouble starting it?

Can you heat the area up where tractor is stored?

I doubt it is cold enough to gel fuel but verify that the fuel and filter are not gelling. I assume that you already have since you come from a much colder climate but you may be assuming the fuel in tank is correct for the winter temperatures and it may not be the correct fuel?


Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk
 

SidecarFlip

Banned

Equipment
M9000HDCC3, M9000HD, Kubota GS850 Sidekick
Oct 28, 2018
7,197
546
83
USA
If it cranks, it should fire or at least try... Does your tractor have a fuel cut solenoid? If the solenoid is faulty or the molex plug has come loose, it will crank all day and not fire.
 

tor

Member
Jun 25, 2009
74
9
8
SC
Are you sure the fuel system is properly bled all the way to the injectors now? Just be sure you have it bled well.

Do you know for sure the glow plugs are working? Has it gotten colder than normal in the morning you had trouble starting it?

Can you heat the area up where tractor is stored?

I doubt it is cold enough to gel fuel but verify that the fuel and filter are not gelling. I assume that you already have since you come from a much colder climate but you may be assuming the fuel in tank is correct for the winter temperatures and it may not be the correct fuel?


Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk
I bled it according to the manual, which is at the filter, with the ignition (fuel pump, which I can hear operating, but don't mean much of course) on for about a minute, then closing the bleed before attempting to start.

We really haven't had enough cold temp to gel the fuel, I don't think. It started without any issues yesterday with a lower temp than today. Currently running Rotella T6 (5W20 synthetic). It's got me scratching my head. I am leaning towards fuel cut-off solenoid or similar, but not sure. The only indication I currently have for a working glow plug is the glow plug indicator light on the dash, which goes out after a few seconds, depending on the temp. I also charged the battery to full charge, and the engine is turning as fast as it normally does under normal conditions.

Will call the dealer tomorrow.
 
Last edited:

Russell King

Well-known member

Equipment
L185F, Modern Ag Competitor 4’ shredder, Rhino tiller, rear dirt scoop
Jun 17, 2012
4,603
975
113
Austin, Texas
You might search for that term “fuel cutoff” or “fuel solenoid” on here. There have been several threads on those going bad.

Check fuses for that?


Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk
 

North Idaho Wolfman

Moderator
Staff member
Lifetime Member

Equipment
L3450DT-GST, Woods FEL, B7100 HSD, FEL, 60" SB, 743 Bobcat with V2203, and more
Jun 9, 2013
28,286
4,853
113
Sandpoint, ID
Check all the fuses?

There is no fuel cut off or fuel solenoid on that model, it's a common rail computer controlled engine.

And yes if under warranty let the dealer figure it out, the fuel delivery parts on that model are not easy to work on, or very cheap to replace! ;)
 
Last edited:

tor

Member
Jun 25, 2009
74
9
8
SC
Dealer tech came and looked at it yesterday. No go. Dealer boss then came up and picked her up. Currently at the dealer. Under warranty. We’ll see what they find.
I was watching the tech. Didn’t look like the fuel solenoid was moving very good. Had fuel all the way through fuel filter.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
 

tor

Member
Jun 25, 2009
74
9
8
SC
Update:

Dealer worked with Kubota during the troubleshooting. They finally decided to replace the high pressure supply pump. Viola, my girl came back to life. Replaced under warranty. FYI: MSRP on that pump is approx. $2.700 :eek:. Same pump use in a lot of models.

 

SidecarFlip

Banned

Equipment
M9000HDCC3, M9000HD, Kubota GS850 Sidekick
Oct 28, 2018
7,197
546
83
USA
For 2700 bucks, think I'd keep the tractor until the warranty expired and off it. Out of warranty parts cost is prohibitive in my view.
 

D2Cat

Well-known member
Lifetime Member

Equipment
L305DT, B7100HST, TG1860, TG1860D, L4240
Mar 27, 2014
12,898
4,265
113
40 miles south of Kansas City
Na, no need to get rid of it because of the pump cost. Dealers replace the whole thing, and it could have probably been rebuilt for a small fraction of the full cost.

Just like in the mid 90's when GM had trouble with the PMD (pump mounted driver) on the 6.5's that was mounted on the side of the IP. Take the truck to the GM dealer and they pulled the IP and installed new. There was nothing wrong with the IP, but the PMD was attached, so they replaced it all.

It didn't take too long to be able to buy a new PMD, a 6' extension, a heat sink, and mount in behind the front bumper....and it would last for years. And the PMD soon was available for $300.
 

North Idaho Wolfman

Moderator
Staff member
Lifetime Member

Equipment
L3450DT-GST, Woods FEL, B7100 HSD, FEL, 60" SB, 743 Bobcat with V2203, and more
Jun 9, 2013
28,286
4,853
113
Sandpoint, ID
For 2700 bucks, think I'd keep the tractor until the warranty expired and off it. Out of warranty parts cost is prohibitive in my view.
All new tractors have essentially the same system, so there is really no way around it, unless you just want to stay with an old tractor. ;)
 

SidecarFlip

Banned

Equipment
M9000HDCC3, M9000HD, Kubota GS850 Sidekick
Oct 28, 2018
7,197
546
83
USA
All new tractors have essentially the same system, so there is really no way around it, unless you just want to stay with an old tractor. ;)

Why I won't be buying one.....lol Maybe I should say if I do, not a Kubota. Now an older well maintain Kubota, no issue, or JD or Massey or CNH, all good.

No wonder my dealer is always chafing at the bit for me to trade in my pre-tier 4 units.

I find it interesting that in the heavy truck world, most small fleets and OO's glider kit their trucks to keep the pre emission engines.
 

eserv

Well-known member

Equipment
BX24, A1000 Kubota Generator
May 27, 2009
2,110
112
63
Hardisty, Alberta
Why I won't be buying one.....lol Maybe I should say if I do, not a Kubota. Now an older well maintain Kubota, no issue, or JD or Massey or CNH, all good.

No wonder my dealer is always chafing at the bit for me to trade in my pre-tier 4 units.

I find it interesting that in the heavy truck world, most small fleets and OO's glider kit their trucks to keep the pre emission engines.
Do you still have your horse and buggy too? LOL
 

SidecarFlip

Banned

Equipment
M9000HDCC3, M9000HD, Kubota GS850 Sidekick
Oct 28, 2018
7,197
546
83
USA
Do you still have your horse and buggy too? LOL
Actually, yes. My wife raises and sells Percheron Draft horses so we not only have a buggy (proper term is a driving cart for those that don't know the difference) and a show wagon.

No LOL needed. It's business with her.

Far as I'm concerned, EPA mandated diesel technology without the proper groundwork has turned a once stone reliable engine into a disaster and I don't want one.

Not just Kubota either. Any and all diesel engines that fall under the Tier 4 final mandate are suspect.

I'm still involved in the Class 8 truck market and no one is happy about the mandate, especially those on the paying end. At the dealership I'm affiliated with, a full 78% of all repairs, both in warranty and out of warranty are now emissions related.

Complexity always reduces reliability.

Rudolph Diesel would probably turn over in his grave if he saw what the emissions police have done to his design
 

North Idaho Wolfman

Moderator
Staff member
Lifetime Member

Equipment
L3450DT-GST, Woods FEL, B7100 HSD, FEL, 60" SB, 743 Bobcat with V2203, and more
Jun 9, 2013
28,286
4,853
113
Sandpoint, ID
Flip,
I don't know how or why you choose the spin off on emissions. :rolleyes:

Common rail fuel injection doesn't really have anything to do with emissions, it has to do with a more accurate fuel distribution and performance system.
You can get about 20 better economy and performance out of a common rail engine.
Your mechanical fuel sucking M's would do much better with a common rail system giving them fuel properly when they needed it.
 

SidecarFlip

Banned

Equipment
M9000HDCC3, M9000HD, Kubota GS850 Sidekick
Oct 28, 2018
7,197
546
83
USA
Flip,
I don't know how or why you choose the spin off on emissions. :rolleyes:

Common rail fuel injection doesn't really have anything to do with emissions, it has to do with a more accurate fuel distribution and performance system.
You can get about 20 better economy and performance out of a common rail engine.
Your mechanical fuel sucking M's would do much better with a common rail system giving them fuel properly when they needed it.
Because emissions hardware make an engine more complex and less reliable. The reliability downgrade comes at the expense of lowest bidder components and don't tell me Kubota manufacturers their own emissions components because they don't. You know that and so do I.

Far as my M's sucking fuel, I find them to be pretty efficient and much simpler than current engines. Never had a concern about fuel used per acre run. I find them both to be very efficient, one reason why I bought them in the first place. Now my old Case with the inline, turbocharged 6 was a guzzler.

But then I'm not dumping raw fuel into a DPF cannister to burn particulates nor do I have to worry about the end of life replacement of that cannister either, 'cause I don't have one. While on that subject, no EGR valve to coke up either. No need to park the tractor to let it regenerate or worry about warmup idling. Bet I'd really plug the DPF when I warm up the 9 for 45 minutes when it's real cold outside so the hydraulic oil is flowing properly.

The schematic of the CR injection system with all the components is far more complex than mine with a lift pump, filter(s), injection pump and injectors. Like said, complexity breeds failure especially with lowest bidder components.

If I live long enough I may be stuck with a Tier 4 final engine, but I certainly hope not.

Why I have my eye on a used Deere 90 horse FWA utility tractor that is pre-Tier 4.

The way it's going, I suspect lawnmowers will soon have catalytic converters too.

The current crop of Tier 4 final diesels reminds me of the cars of the 60's. Festooned with emissions crap that was failure prone and did nothing for life expectancy of the engine.

I'll just stay moot about emissions hardware because I don't have (nor want) any if I can avoid it.

Hopefully, the builders will get it sorted out like the automakers did.

Until then I just chuckle when I see the guy down the road with his big Deere track machine sitting in a half tilled field with the service truck next to it with the technician trying to diagnose the issue because the engine derated and the tractor is for all intents and purposes a rock and the farmer has a schedule to keep that he's not going to. Might as well retire to the barn and get loaded while the dealer try's to figure out what happened and then fix it, if the parts are available that is.

In 2200 hours on the 9 and 1900 on the 105, I have not experienced one engine failure related to injection or anything else for that matter. One failed lift cylinder on the 105 that was under warranty and that's it.

...and they both get worked and worked hard because I have schedules to keep too. Neither are hobby tractors.