UDT or Super UDT?

kubotaworks

New member

Equipment
1994 L2650
Mar 2, 2009
6
0
0
Northeast Washington State
I'm new to the forum and recently purchased a L2650 from a local dealer....in changing all of the fluids, should I stick with UDT for the transmission and hydraulics, or can I put in Super UDT? Any advantage to the Super UDT besides better for cold weather operation?
 

phyxer

New member
Jul 13, 2009
2
0
0
Altus, OK
www.troyandlesa.com
I have a B2620 I purchased new this spring. I went to my dealer this weekend and bought everything to do the 50 hour service myself. I asked my dealer which hydraulic fluid to put back in and he said UDT would be fine. In fact, they don't carry the SUDT. He said that nobody buys it and they haven't had any reason to believe that the SUDT does anything the UDT doesn't. We live in SW Oklahoma where it is 100+ degrees all summer long and it seldom drops below freezing for longer than a day or two. So my B2620 which according to the manual came from the factory with SUDT will be getting it's fluid replaced with plain ole UDT fluid. Just wanted to pass along what I was told. If anyone thinks my dealer is way off base, please feel free substantiate your claims. Thanks in advance. :p

Troy
 

Ob1kubota

New member

Equipment
M9540DT
Jul 26, 2009
316
0
0
Birmingham, AL
While I agree with Vic on temperature and viscosities, SUDT is about how quick it gets there and what it does once there. On the molecular level you are lubricating metal to metal components that are reciprocating, rotating and compressing under great pressures. I have always found in mechanical experience the lubricity of petroleum products are based on friction modifers added to compounds that promote anti-wear and scar resistance formulas to basic organic crudes. ( academic terms for slickness ) The chemical properties of SUDT Vs UDT are all about " slickness '.... now you don't have to be an engineer to understand the value and longetivity of replacing lube oils especially these day when dollars are tight in this Obama economy in the States. Please take the time to learn these terms and then you decide whether or not you want to expose your new B2620 investment to anything less than what the engineers put in it from the factory.....

Kubota Super UDT Fluid



Kubota Super UDT has been developed as per the stringent specifications of Kubota-Japan.



Kubota Super UDT has been formulated using premium base-stocks and optimized chemistry to deliver increased performance and durability.



Key Features

Low Temperature Fluidity

Kubota evaluates fluid performance in a pump test stand at -30degC.



Improved flow for Super UDT compared to UDT and other commercial tractor hydraulic fluids.







Kubota Super UDT Key Features

Kubota Super UDT provides

Improved hydraulic transmission control



Smoother start of tractor's HST (hydrostatic transmission) at low temperatures



Improved flow through filters during cold temperature start-up.



Less wear on metal parts since Super UDT flows to critical contact areas during start-up.



Reducing Brake Squawk

Kubota evaluates a fluid's performance in SAE #2 machine and low velocity friction test.



Oil "C" is likely to cause squawk in either wet brakes or transmission clutches.



Kubota Super UDT is evaluated with transmission clutch and wet brake friction material.



Stable Friction Performance

Tractor fluids need to maintain friction properties during life of fluid, to insure proper operation of transmission clutches.



Other oil shows deteriorating friction which can lead to poor/harsh shifting, lessened torque transfer and possible wet clutch failure.



Super UDT is improved over previous UDT, offering longer friction stability. Testing is conducted in Kubota's own wet clutch test system.





Water Tolerance

Kubota Super UDT performance evaluated in the presence of water (0.2%-1.0%)



Super UDT maintains

-Stable friction for clutches
-Smooth gear shifting
-No brake squawk even when water (0.2%) is mixed into
oil

Super UDT will not clog filter even when mixed with 1.0% water. Some fluids form sediment or solids that will clog or block important filters.



Kubota Super UDT features and benefits

Features
Benefits

Water Tolerance
No Rust- Reduces wear and tear on equipment

Smooth gear shifts

No brake squawk

Longer equipment life


Improved Shear Ability
Fluid has correct viscosity at high temperature. No metal to metal contact

Less shear of fluid means less power loss in hydraulic pumps

Proper viscosity means proper transmission shifting

Longer equipment life, less down time


Low temperature fluidity
Faster cold weather starts

Less time needed for warm-up

Hydraulics ready to operate with less jerking

Less metal to metal contact

Longer equipment life; less down time


Unique friction characteristics
Smooth gear shifts. Less operator shift shocks

No brake squawk. Less operator fatigue

Maintain brake capacity for safe stopping

Clutches and brake pads last longer

Improved equipment durability ;)
 

OrangeRidge

New member
Jul 10, 2010
70
1
0
Queensland Australia
A year on and I have a question ;

Kubota Australia don't import SUDT , only UDT . Now my new BX has
factory filled SUDT ( so we're lead to believe ) which in 50 hours
time will require a replacement . What's the viscosity/spec of
Kubota SUDT ( UDT is 20w ? ) so that I can locate another companies
product equiv. ? Is it a synthetic 5w/30 ?
 

eserv

Well-known member

Equipment
BX24, A1000 Kubota Generator
May 27, 2009
2,110
112
63
Hardisty, Alberta
We can only get premium udt in Canada. My service rep. tells me it is the same as super udt! It really does make a difference in the power shift tractors but the other machines don't seem to be as fussy. I have never seen a kubota transmission OR engine failure that I would attribute to poor lubrication. I have seen a few fail because of NO lubrication. Keep them filled and they will all give a happy carefree life!
Ed
 

OrangeRidge

New member
Jul 10, 2010
70
1
0
Queensland Australia
Research

Spent some time on the Net and have come to the following conclusion ;
SUDT is near as damn it the same as JD Low Viscosity Hy-Gard JD20D.
They have nearly identical profiles at 40 and 100 centigrade and visco
index.
Now this is interesting ; I'm not familiar with JD hydro fluids , so when I
'phoned the local JD Dealer for a price on Hy-Gard fluids , he informs me
that JD Australia now only import Low Visc because it's far superior to
the 20w standard Hy-Gard that's too thick at temps below 70 f .
He reckoned that at 60 centigrade system operating temps , both
Hy Gards are equal viscosity , but that takes an hour or so ...........
For my 50hr , I'll use JD20D in the BX.
 

archelon99

New member

Equipment
L 1501 DT
May 14, 2010
5
0
0
Richmond, BC
I have a L1501DT (1975) Kubota with no synchromesh gears in the transmission. i.e. all straight cut gears. Kubota has told that I should be using UDT. That doesn't make any sense to me when the specifications call for 80W in the transmission and 90W in the differential. Can anyone shed some light on this very confusing topic?
 

Bulldog

Well-known member

Equipment
M 9000 DTC, L 3000 DT
Mar 30, 2010
5,440
73
48
Rocky Face, Georgia
A year on and I have a question ;

Kubota Australia don't import SUDT , only UDT . Now my new BX has
factory filled SUDT ( so we're lead to believe ) which in 50 hours
time will require a replacement . What's the viscosity/spec of
Kubota SUDT ( UDT is 20w ? ) so that I can locate another companies
product equiv. ? Is it a synthetic 5w/30 ?
I know you can get Amsoil there. Their brand of tractor trans/hyd fluid works better than the SUDT did. I don't imagine cold is a issue for you so this might interest you. My trans temp lowered up to 70 degrees after switching it to Amsoil.
 

Bulldog

Well-known member

Equipment
M 9000 DTC, L 3000 DT
Mar 30, 2010
5,440
73
48
Rocky Face, Georgia
OrangeRidge, I use Amsoil products in everything I own. Engines, trans, gear boxes, and anything that takes grease. I normally don't say much about it any more because Amsoil seems to ruffle feathers among the orange brothers. I've been using Amsoil for almost 20 yrs now so if you have any questions I'll be happy to try and help you out.
 

Sam427

New member

Equipment
L3410 GST, FEL, Bush Hog, Box Scrape, Spreader
Nov 6, 2009
194
5
0
Snellville, Ga. USA
OrangeRidge, I use Amsoil products in everything I own. Engines, trans, gear boxes, and anything that takes grease. I normally don't say much about it any more because Amsoil seems to ruffle feathers among the orange brothers. I've been using Amsoil for almost 20 yrs now so if you have any questions I'll be happy to try and help you out.
I don't think you ruffle any feathers with the Amsoil preachings, it's just that some don't see it as being worth the money it cost.

As you know, I did not see favorable results when I switched my truck over to it. I would normally go 7000 to 8000 miles on a conventional oil change, and the Amsoil was supposed to go twice the mileage, it didn't. I did see roughly a half a mile per gallon increase at first, but that was gone after a few thousand miles, and the mileage got so bad I was forced to change well before the 15,000 miles it should have went. It also burned more oil than normal conventional, twice as much. I have used standard Valvoline Conventional, Valvoline High Mileage, and Pennzoil Extended Mileage in my truck, by far, the best oil has been the Pennzoil, and it's conventional oil too. I also changed the rear diff lube and saw no difference.

Everyone that has had to buy Kubota parts knows that it isn't cheap, and their oil is no different, it cost roughly $30 more for 5 gallons compared to a good quality Shell product, which will work just fine in any Kubota as long as you buy the correct product. It's about being able to afford to use your equipment. At the prices Amsoil charges, you can't afford to do too many oil changes, as it is double what other oils cost, it just doesn't make economic sense.;)
 

Bulldog

Well-known member

Equipment
M 9000 DTC, L 3000 DT
Mar 30, 2010
5,440
73
48
Rocky Face, Georgia
I don't think you ruffle any feathers with the Amsoil preachings, it's just that some don't see it as being worth the money it cost.

As you know, I did not see favorable results when I switched my truck over to it. I would normally go 7000 to 8000 miles on a conventional oil change, and the Amsoil was supposed to go twice the mileage, it didn't. I did see roughly a half a mile per gallon increase at first, but that was gone after a few thousand miles, and the mileage got so bad I was forced to change well before the 15,000 miles it should have went. It also burned more oil than normal conventional, twice as much.

It's about being able to afford to use your equipment. At the prices Amsoil charges, you can't afford to do too many oil changes, as it is double what other oils cost, it just doesn't make economic sense.;)
Just curious, did you flush the engine before the oil change?

My F 150 gained 2 mpg just with the engine oil change and I ran my oil for 25,000 miles between changes. It didn't burn any oil.

"Burned twice as much oil than normal"
I think normal is "0" so it sounds like there's already some type of wear or leak issue.
Amsoil does lots for engine but it's not a miracle in a bottle. A engine that already burns oil most likely will use more of any brand synthetic oil. Synthetic flows so much easier it would just make sence that it would burn more, leak more or whatever the case may be.

My buddy puts 80,000 miles on a Mack dump truck each year on one change of Amsoil. That's one change per year instead of 8. In the last 15 yrs he has change oil 15 times instead of 120 times using standard oil. :eek:
I would say that Amsoil has save him several thousand in oil changes alone. :D

The last time I bushhogged this last year I ran 12 hrs on my M 9000 pulling a 15' batwing. 92 hp at pto speed for 12 hrs on 15 gal of fuel. 1.25 gallons per hr. About 1/3 the fuel consumption it's advertised to use.

When I first got my trackhoe it was burning about 1 gph of fuel. After changing oil I'm in the neighborhood of 1/2 gph.
That makes perfect economic sense to me. :cool:
 

TripleR

Active member

Equipment
BX2200, BX2660, L5740 HSTC, M8540HDC and some other tractors and equipment
Sep 16, 2011
1,911
7
38
SE Missouri
I have been flamed more on oil threads on different threads than anything, so I really don't want to start an argument or debate.

We can only judge by our own experiences; some have been great while others not so much.

I come from a family of mechanics with one Mechanical Engineer who prided himself in keeping his vehicles running well beyond what any one would reasonably believe.

We have not tried Amzoil, but tried some others in cars, trucks, tractors and motorcycles.

Our results came no where near what was advertised, so we have stopped using them. I am glad to see they work for some.

I sure wish they had as changing oil is getting a lot harder the older I get; may have to start using the FEL on one tractor to get me up off the creeper after working on another.:(
 

TripleR

Active member

Equipment
BX2200, BX2660, L5740 HSTC, M8540HDC and some other tractors and equipment
Sep 16, 2011
1,911
7
38
SE Missouri
You said it. I don't try to share my experiences much any more because it always turns into a debate and goes nowhere.
Ain't it the truth; I had to stop posting on a couple of forums due to offering no more than what I just posted.

We won't even go into when I offered my opinion/experience with the much beloved 1911.:(
 

Sam427

New member

Equipment
L3410 GST, FEL, Bush Hog, Box Scrape, Spreader
Nov 6, 2009
194
5
0
Snellville, Ga. USA
Just curious, did you flush the engine before the oil change?

My F 150 gained 2 mpg just with the engine oil change and I ran my oil for 25,000 miles between changes. It didn't burn any oil.

"Burned twice as much oil than normal"
I think normal is "0" so it sounds like there's already some type of wear or leak issue.
Amsoil does lots for engine but it's not a miracle in a bottle. A engine that already burns oil most likely will use more of any brand synthetic oil. Synthetic flows so much easier it would just make sence that it would burn more, leak more or whatever the case may be.

My buddy puts 80,000 miles on a Mack dump truck each year on one change of Amsoil. That's one change per year instead of 8. In the last 15 yrs he has change oil 15 times instead of 120 times using standard oil. :eek:
I would say that Amsoil has save him several thousand in oil changes alone. :D

The last time I bushhogged this last year I ran 12 hrs on my M 9000 pulling a 15' batwing. 92 hp at pto speed for 12 hrs on 15 gal of fuel. 1.25 gallons per hr. About 1/3 the fuel consumption it's advertised to use.

When I first got my trackhoe it was burning about 1 gph of fuel. After changing oil I'm in the neighborhood of 1/2 gph.
That makes perfect economic sense to me. :cool:
Normally my truck burns maybe a half a quart on an 8000 mile oil change, certainly in the acceptable range. With the Amzoil it burned close to two quarts in within 13,000 miles. The oil change after the Amzoil was back to normal.

Everybody should use whatever they feel is best and works for them. I tried it, didn't care for it at all, and will stick with what works best for me.:D If you have been using Amzoil for 20 years and haven't tried anything else, maybe you should, technology has come a long way in 20 years.
 

Sam427

New member

Equipment
L3410 GST, FEL, Bush Hog, Box Scrape, Spreader
Nov 6, 2009
194
5
0
Snellville, Ga. USA
I have been flamed more on oil threads on different threads than anything, so I really don't want to start an argument or debate.

We can only judge by our own experiences; some have been great while others not so much.

I come from a family of mechanics with one Mechanical Engineer who prided himself in keeping his vehicles running well beyond what any one would reasonably believe.

We have not tried Amzoil, but tried some others in cars, trucks, tractors and motorcycles.

Our results came no where near what was advertised, so we have stopped using them. I am glad to see they work for some.

I sure wish they had as changing oil is getting a lot harder the older I get; may have to start using the FEL on one tractor to get me up off the creeper after working on another.:(
I look at it this way, oil is going to get nasty, regardless of what brand or type, it just the nature of the beast. After seeing how nasty the Amzoil was at 13,000 miles, I will never go that far on an oil change again, it can't be good for wear on parts. The big oil companies have good product at a reasonable price, just find something that fits your budget and keep it changed on a regular basis, should do just fine.
 

Sam427

New member

Equipment
L3410 GST, FEL, Bush Hog, Box Scrape, Spreader
Nov 6, 2009
194
5
0
Snellville, Ga. USA
And if you just have to have orange fluid for your orange tractor, look no further.:D

Chevron Synthetic All-Weather THF


Customer Benefits

Chevron Synthetic All-Weather THF delivers value through

Reducing operational costs � Excellent performance in a wide range of ambient and operating temperatures provides year-round improved low temperature hydraulic and transmission responsiveness versus typical John Deere J20C fluids. This eliminates the need to switch fluids between seasons thereby saving substantial operating expense.

Longer oil life � Outstanding ability of the base stock to withstand oxidation at high operating temperatures results in increased service life of the oil.

Longer equipment life � Special additives protect metal surfaces against scuffing and wear even under severe operating conditions � leading to increased equipment life.

Lower inventory cost � One fluid does the job of a full range of mobile hydraulic systems. Can replace multiple products and free up shelf space too!

Minimizing weather and storage concerns � Protects against rust and corrosion of highly finished precision parts when operating in humid conditions and during seasonal shutdown periods.

Reduced downtime � Good compatibility with seals, O-rings, and packing materials maintains their good condition and keeps leakage at a minimum.

Smoother operation � By eliminating brake "chatter" and transmission "slip" it assures quiet and efficient action of brakes and transmission.

More reliable operation � Formulation keeps metal parts clean and free of varnish and sludge deposits that could result in premature breakdown.


Features

Chevron Synthetic All-Weather THF is a truly unique, high quality, multifunctional fluid, specially formulated for use in transmissions, final drives, wet brakes, and hydraulic systems of tractors and other equipment employing a common fluid reservoir.

Chevron Synthetic All-Weather THF is specially designed for unsurpassed operation in all types of weather � both severe winter cold and extreme summer heat. In fact, Chevron Synthetic All-Weather THF meets the requirements of both John Deere J20C and J20D specifications. This, combined with excellent oxidation stability, eliminates the need for seasonal oil changes.

Its distinctive orange color provides for easy product identification and leak detection.


Functions

Chevron Synthetic All-Weather THF is an unsurpassed combination lubricant for modern tractors and similar equipment. It performs many functions, such as lubrication of the transmission and final drive, and serves as a hydraulic fluid to operate power steering units, brakes, implements, and attachments.

Chevron Synthetic All-Weather THF has a viscosity index much higher than typical multifunctional transmission/hydraulic fluids. This provides excellent flow at low temperatures and good oil film protection at high operating temperatures.

Furthermore, Chevron Synthetic All-Weather THF
eliminates brake "chatter" and excessive brake facing wear
assures smooth operation of clutch packs and wet brakes
provides excellent shifting action
provides superior rust and corrosion protection for vital parts
minimizes leakage because of good compatibility with seals, O-rings, and packing materials
prevents sludge and varnish formation
protects metal surfaces against scuffing and wear
provides superior gear lubrication compared to typical cold weather, low viscosity tractor hydraulic fluids
allows for ready leak detection because of its distinctive orange color.

Chevron Synthetic All-Weather THF is compatible with other combination tractor, transmission, and hydraulic fluids. It is recommended as an Allison C4 fluid for use in their transmissions.


Applications

Chevron Synthetic All-Weather THF is recommended for use
as a multifunctional and multiseasonal fluid in all types of tractors and construction equipment.
in any application which calls for the following OEM lubricant specifications:

John Deere � J20C, J20D
AGCO � improved power fluid 821XL
Ford New Holland � ESN-M2C134-D, FNHA-2-C-201, FNHA-2-C-200
Massey Ferguson � M1135, M1141, M1127, M1129A
White Farm Equipment � Q-1826
Case � JIC-143, JIC-145, MS 1206, MS 1207
Oliver � Type 55
Minneapolis-Moline Fluids
Caterpillar TO-2
Renk � Bus Automatic Transmission Fluid
Allison C4
Kubota Super UDT, UDT
International Harvester B6

Chevron Synthetic All-Weather THF is an excellent hydraulic fluid for all types of hydraulic systems. It passes the High Pressure Vane Pump Test, ASTM D 2882, with less than 15 mg steel weight loss.

Do not use in high pressure systems in the vicinity of flames, sparks and hot surfaces. Use only in well ventilated areas. Keep container closed.


Typical Test Data


CPS Number 255237
MSDS Number 6948
API Gravity 34.5
Viscosity, Kinematic
cSt at 40�C
cSt at 100�C 44.7
9.5
Viscosity, Saybolt
SUS at 100�F
SUS at 210�F 225
58.2
Viscosity, Brookfield
cP at -40�C 17,000
Viscosity Index 204
Flash Point, �C(�F) 242(468)
Pour Point, �C(�F) -45(-49)
Color Orange

Typical test data are average values only. Minor variations which do not affect product performance are to be expected in normal manufacturing.

Source: TTF-45
Date: 09/18/2000
Copyright � 1999, 2000, 2001 ChevronTexaco Corporation. All rights reserved.